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RapeLay
MiquelFire
Member #3,110
January 2003
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I remember Carmageddon! I played that one.

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Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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The problem with a game like RapeLay is that it exploits sexual desire of humans. Something most people have problem controlling.

You can kill someone in a game and not even think about it. But it's damn near impossible to not be aroused by sex. And the problem with that is that people become different people when aroused. They lose the ability to think rationally. Studies have shown that when people are aroused and asked questions that they'd normally say "no" to like "would you consider sex involving animals?" are actually MORE opt to say yes. (from the book Predictably Irrational)

So my only concern is whether it can (on a consistent basis) warp peoples perspectives and actions in real life.

Should it be banned? I don't really know either way. It's public impact is nil. If it becomes very popular... then it becomes a big issue with the pragmatic aspect winning over theory and principles like freedom of speech.

So yeah... I basically just spent 10 minutes cleverly writing, "I don't know."

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LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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ReyBrujo said:

Yeah, and ex-soldiers that committed suicide.

Unless they were drafted, that's a bad analogy. Rape victims don't choose to be raped (obviously), whereas most soldiers these days volunteer, and should be fully responsible for the consequences of what happens to them.

axilmar
Member #1,204
April 2001

It's obvious really: hurting someone in the course of defending yourself is acceptable, hurting someone for pleasure is not.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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LennyLen said:

whereas most soldiers these days volunteer, and should be fully responsible for the consequences of what happens to them.

That's not true. They may volunteer in good faith, and then be given unjustifiable assignments.

This is particularly the case for people who join the National Guard because they are told their services will only be training one weekend a month along with one 2-week humanitarian stint (e.g., flood control) per year. Next thing they know, they are shipped out to Iraq for an undetermined amount of time only to be blown up by road side bombs.

But that example aside, what do you think about World War games that involved people who were drafted? Is it wrong to kill them in video games? Does it matter which side you are on? What if you take the Nazi Germany side?

OICW
Member #4,069
November 2003
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Allright, just finished reading wikipedia entry and from what I've read I think that this game is sick. Definitely crosses some moral standards, but on the other hand, who defines them? This is upon polemic, which I don't want to go into.

One thing that caught my attention is this line from entry upon Illusion soft:

Wikipedia said:

Due to Illusion's policy, its games are not intended to be sold or used outside of Japan, and official support is only given in Japanese and for use in Japan.

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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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It's a game.

It's not real.

What you do outside of Real Life (TM) is none of my concern.

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X-G
Member #856
December 2000
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RapeLay wasn't an incredible game, in retrospect. The graphics were fairly decent, actually, but nothing special in light of more recent eroge. However, when it was new, that was kind of a new thing, so it still gets points for it.

The story is pretty much as shallow as you'd expect, but the same can be said for most games and it wasn't awful compared to its competitors. However, it has pretty shitty replayability; I don't remember it having more than a few endings. I can't remember if it had any alternate modes, but I think it didn't.

All in all, a 3.5/5 that could've been so much more, but it was limited by the technological standards of its times and lackluster writing.

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Ron Novy
Member #6,982
March 2006
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Again... Having it as part of the storyline as in a brief moment in the game is different, but having a game based on rape is just bad taste... The graphics and technology used is irrelevant in this case... It could have been an FPS or RPG in 3D or 2D with wire mesh or horrible icons for graphics. It's the plot that sucks...

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OICW
Member #4,069
November 2003
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That says something about the developers and part of a culture in which it was created.

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"You can discuss it, you can dislike it, you can disagree with it, but that's all what you can do with it"

Karadoc ~~
Member #2,749
September 2002
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axilmar said:

It's obvious really: hurting someone in the course of defending yourself is acceptable, hurting someone for pleasure is not.

What is obvious? Violent video games don't hurt anyone, whether they are about shooting people or raping people. Besides, there are many games in which the player is encouraged to kill for reasons other than self defence. So do you think this rape game is ok or not?

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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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The Close Range game from the other thread is a perfect example of the double standards most people have. Shooting the heads off of innocent people is funny. The Onion dare not make the same joke about raping.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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The Close Range game from the other thread is a perfect example of the double standards most people have. Shooting the heads off of innocent people is funny. The Onion dare not make the same joke about raping.

1) Those people aren't innocent. They're evil. It's explained in the opening cutscene.

2) I don't like that game. It seems like violence for the sole purpose of violence. Yes, the story says you're saving your, brother, was it? But that's just an excuse to show lots of gore. I feel the same way about Gears of War, but at least that game made it clear that war is a bad thing.

Vanneto
Member #8,643
May 2007

Where is it explained that the people are evil? The kidnappers are evil, sure. But random people popping up in front of your face? Where does it say they are evil? No matter though, killing is killing, evil or not. Rape is rape, even if the victim is evil...

In capitalist America bank robs you.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Vanneto said:

Where is it explained that the people are evil? The kidnappers are evil, sure. But random people popping up in front of your face? Where does it say they are evil?

I thought all the people I was shooting at were working for the kidnappers. I guess I was wrong, now I like the game even less.

Dustin Dettmer
Member #3,935
October 2003
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Hm, No one is making the usual argument, "If they get it out in a game they wont do it in real life." Interesting. I guess that argument is only applied when its convenient.

None of this matters. One of two things will happen: 1) Nothing intersting, or 2) Politicians will use it to advance their careers and newspaper writers will drone on about it saying nothing interesting. Then some laws pop up that are defined by "group think" and the bizarre rules that govern politics.

Karadoc ~~
Member #2,749
September 2002
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Hm, No one is making the usual argument, "If they get it out in a game they wont do it in real life." Interesting. I guess that argument is only applied when its convenient.

I don't think it's a matter of being convenient...
I thought about mentioning that kind of argument, but decided not to because I don't think it's really clear how these things work. I can imagine a person who, for whatever reason, has a strong urge to rape - when this person plays the game they can satisfy some of the urge without harming anyone. That would be good. But on the other hand I can also imagine someone tries the game because they are lonely or just curious about rape, and after playing the game many times they develop a real desire for rape, and a kind of disconnected sense of "normalness" about rape... So the first person I mentioned has been helped by the game and they are now a safer person to be around, but the second person has become more dangerous. Who knows which people are more common?

(I would guess that the most people wouldn't fit either of those personalities. They might play the game because they are bored or something, and the game probably won't have any significant effect on their life.)

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TestSubject
Member #8,989
August 2007
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I can't get close range to work. It's distressing.

Considering the game is made to mock...everything, I'm not surprised by its content in the least.

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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That's not true. They may volunteer in good faith, and then be given unjustifiable assignments.

This is particularly the case for people who join the National Guard because they are told their services will only be training one weekend a month along with one 2-week humanitarian stint (e.g., flood control) per year. Next thing they know, they are shipped out to Iraq for an undetermined amount of time only to be blown up by road side bombs.

That's a good point, and I wasn't aware the case you mentioned had happened. When I said soldiers, I was thinking of people who volunteer to fight, and kill, for their country. Not people who think that they're going to get to play at soldiers (march around in pretty uniforms, fire off a few rounds down at the shooting range), without ever facing the enemy.

The NZ version of the National Guard, the Territorial Forces, are told before they even sign up that can be expected to serve overseas in warzones, and they often do. The only real difference between regular army and territorials in NZ is whether you're part time or full time. The duties are still the same. But considering that the NZ army's role is usually only ever peace keeping duties, not many of our soldiers ever see combat.

Quote:

But that example aside, what do you think about World War games that involved people who were drafted? Is it wrong to kill them in video games? Does it matter which side you are on? What if you take the Nazi Germany side?

I'm of the same opinion with this as I am with RapeLay. I don't believe that there is a connection between video game violence and real life violence, so I don't think it's wrong to play these games.

But as I said earlier, that if it could be shown that these games did lead to a marked increase in the number of violent acts committed against innocent people, then that's when we need to start looking at things like bans.

But on the other hand I can also imagine someone tries the game because they are lonely or just curious about rape, and after playing the game many times they develop a real desire for rape, and a kind of disconnected sense of "normalness" about rape...

I discussed this issue once with my girlfriend's mother, who works as a councillor in a juvenile sex offender facility (ironically, she's also an on-call immediate response councillor for rape victims as well). She didn't think many would get any satisfaction at all out of playing such games as most of the kids she works with need to have a victim.

Also, many rapists who rape for sexual gratification don't start out with rape, it's something they move on to. Initially they might get enough satisfaction out of spying on women, and when that stops being enough, they will often move to stalking women, and doing things like stealing their underwear. These behaviours can normalize their view of the criminal nature of what they are already doing, which makes the idea of rape more accessible. And this is when they go from being a mostly-harmless creepy guy to becoming a sexual predator.

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Hm, No one is making the usual argument, "If they get it out in a game they wont do it in real life."

The problem with this line is that others can tell you that if they get it out in a game, they will do it in real life. Since it is not possible to demonstrate or deny either, it is better to leave it out.

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Dustin Dettmer
Member #3,935
October 2003
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Quote:

.. it is better to leave [the argument] out.

It is ironic to me that, for only this scenario, it is better to leave it out. Selective "logic".

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Oh, I didn't mean you should not use it ;) I considered using it, but I left it out since I cannot demonstrate someone would be able to contain his perversion by playing this game. Can you?

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RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

Ron Novy
Member #6,982
March 2006
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[edit]
>:( Not laughing anymore...

Quote:

Update 04-07-09: Murdered Sandra Cantu

A suitcase discovered by farmworkers at about 10 a.m. yesterday contained the body of missing Sandra Cantu. Her remains were found in an area previously searched. Farmworkers were draining apond to water a field at a dairy farm on Bacchetti Road when the container was discovered. An autopsy is schedule for this morning.

http://missingchild.wordpress.com/2009/03/29/missing-child-in-tracy-california/

You could probably guess what they'll say after they release the reports...

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Jeff Bernard
Member #6,698
December 2005
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Quote:

RapeLay (レイプレイ ?) is a 3D anime hentai game

Can't say I've ready every post in the thread, but I'm honestly surprised that there's this much of a discussion. This is a hentai game. Clearly it is not a real game, it cannot be compared to a real game (even GTA is a real game). That is like saying they should allow pornography (which may contain the bonus of having rape scenes) to be released in major theaters as a legit Hollywood movie just because Hollywood allows movies where people get murdered (and even sometimes raped).

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axilmar
Member #1,204
April 2001

What is obvious? Violent video games don't hurt anyone, whether they are about shooting people or raping people.

They do, when the level of realism is high enough.

Quote:

Besides, there are many games in which the player is encouraged to kill for reasons other than self defence.

All those games are not ok.

Quote:

So do you think this rape game is ok or not?

Not ok.

It's simple: defense = good, offense = bad. Absolutely and on all levels.



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