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Is It Feasible To Colonize Another Planet With Today's Technology?
alethiophile
Member #9,349
December 2007
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I think that the labyrinth only responds to spin in which you are near the center. Otherwise, it will simply be overridden by centrifugal force. Overall, to settle this debate we really just need to try it. Has anyone tried building a spin-for-gravity space station or ship?

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Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
C++: An octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog.
I am the Lightning-Struck Penguin of Doom.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Vanneto said:

If there was a spinning module in the ship for gravity, I think this organ would let us know we are dizzy... But I don't know if this applies in space where there is no gravity.

Keep in mind that the occupants shouldn't feel like they are spinning. In theory, they should feel like they are standing on Earth. The only contradiction to this would be changes to the ship's velocity (direction, speed).

** EDIT **

Thinking in more detail I guess jumping would be bad... :-/ And what would hold you to the "floor"...? :-/

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Quoting someone else: We haven't even explored all the abysses found in oceans, and we already want to go to space? Way to waste money. Therefore, it is not possible to do that unless it is for scientific purposes (it is not cost effective). What happened with that Biosphere thing, where some guys were going to stay in a sphere in the middle of a desert for 7 years?

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RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

alethiophile
Member #9,349
December 2007
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Why wouldn't we want to go to space? There is no livable space at the bottoms of oceans; in space there is, or could be with some effort.

--
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
C++: An octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog.
I am the Lightning-Struck Penguin of Doom.

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Space won't be viable in at least another 100 years. It was just a silly goal put by the US and the USSR during the Cold War.

--
RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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Quote:

Thinking in more detail I guess jumping would be bad... :-/ And what would hold you to the "floor"...? :-/

The angel will. havet you bin in a Gravitron before

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitron

edit:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/11/Gravitron2.jpg

in this pic more then 9.2gs of force is produced

wow
-------------------------------
i am who you are not am i

alethiophile
Member #9,349
December 2007
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What "angel"?

--
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
C++: An octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog.
I am the Lightning-Struck Penguin of Doom.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Quote:

It was just a silly goal put by the US and the USSR during the Cold War.

At least we had something to compete over that didn't involve blowing each other up. ;)

Quote:

Quoting someone else: We haven't even explored all the abysses found in oceans, and we already want to go to space?

The only practical reason I can see today for actually making self-sustaining colonies is because of over-population problems here on Earth. And our current technology is not up to handling the scale of colonization that would be required to handle over-population. But if we tried on a small scale it would give us valuable experience for when we are ready to try for a practical reason.

In other words, the only reason (other than scientific inquiry) for attempting to build a self-sustaining colony today is to give us experience for when we want or need to build one in the future.

alethiophile
Member #9,349
December 2007
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Or, to get humans into another foothold so that if/when the Earth blows itself up, we can repopulate.

--
Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
C++: An octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog.
I am the Lightning-Struck Penguin of Doom.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Quote:

Or, to get humans into another foothold so that if/when the Earth blows itself up, we can repopulate.

That too. ;)

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Quote:

In other words, the only reason (other than scientific inquiry) for attempting to build a self-sustaining colony today is to give us experience for when we want or need to build one in the future.

Earth could hold over twice the amount of current inhabitants. But that would force companies to relinquish certain aspects of their business (like decreasing prices, giving away unused lands, preparing non-inhabitable lands like deserts, etc). And even when these problems were evident, we have no means of moving enough people out of the Earth to another planet to make a difference.

We should be able to mobilize thousands from Earth to our new home in hours, not 20 or 25 people in a month.

The only way it makes sense is because Space is free, and the only borders will be created when companies colonize them. No country can claim ownership of space... but companies can.

--
RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

Slartibartfast
Member #8,789
June 2007
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Quote:

to give us experience for when we want or need to build one in the future.

It's like PHALANAX in UFO: Alien Invasion. Setting up an agency to prepare for an alien invasion sure sounded stupid back in the 1960s, but by 2084 everyone rejoices that PHALANAX already came up with all the manuals/guides/instructions/strategies/tactics required to set up an initial defence against the aliens (and eventually will be able to defeat them).

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Slartibartfast said:

it's like PHALANAX in UFO: Alien Invasion. Setting up an agency to prepare for an alien invasion sure sounded stupid back in the 1960s, but by 2084 everyone rejoices that PHALANAX already came up with all the manuals/guides/instructions/strategies/tactics required to set up an initial defence against the aliens (and eventually will be able to defeat them).

Good analogy.

We know that overpopulation will probably become an issue at some point, unless something changes soon. Why not prepare for it when we have the time?

When did this become a discussion about should we do it instead of could we do it?

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Again, then we should concentrate on transporting thousands of people at the same time instead of trying to setup a house in the Moon. Not worth the trouble putting buildings there if every travel takes a week and can only transport 30 guys at the same time.

--
RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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ReyBrujo said:

gain, then we should concentrate on transporting thousands of people at the same time instead of trying to setup a house in the Moon.

That's what I've been saying. We need a ship that can carry at least several hundred, if not more, people to the colony site.

ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Yet we are concentrating in finding out what is after Pluto. What else? Void!

--
RB
光子「あたしただ…奪う側に回ろうと思っただけよ」
Mitsuko's last words, Battle Royale

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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ReyBrujo said:

Again, then we should concentrate on transporting thousands of people at the same time instead of trying to setup a house in the Moon. Not worth the trouble putting buildings there if every travel takes a week and can only transport 30 guys at the same time.

You gotta crawl before you walk and walk before you run.

ReyBrujo said:

Yet we are concentrating in finding out what is after Pluto. What else? Void!

As far as we know.* It's not uncommon for scientists to discover new things even here on Earth. It isn't far fetched for them to have missed something in space. Besides that, it's not like everyone is focussed on that... There are individuals and teams all over the world dedicated to various aspects of the universe we inhabit.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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Quote:

What else? Void!

Um, there actually is more stuff out there you know. Its just a little too far and a little too cold inorder to see it properly. Last I heard, they expect to find one or two planet sized objects out past pluto in the "near" future.

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Michael Jensen
Member #2,870
October 2002
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tldr -- some people are into fantasy football, but I guess this is what "does-it" for us geeks, isn't it? :P

edit: also, from what I read -- someone seems to be complaining that jumping wouldn't work in simulated gravity -- which isn't true at all -- your horizontal velocity doesn't change while jumping vertically. -- Throw a ball upwards in a moving car -- it will come straight back down to you -- even though it's moving forward at 60 mph and you didn't throw it forward...

Quote:

It was just a silly goal put by the US and the USSR during the Cold War.

No -- it was actually kind of scarry when the USSR beat us into space (we beat them to the moon, which was silly, but into space was not silly), because at that point they had technology to launch intercontental missles at us.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Michael Jensen said:

edit: also, from what I read -- someone seems to be complaining that jumping wouldn't work in simulated gravity -- which isn't true at all -- your horizontal velocity doesn't change while jumping vertically. -- Throw a ball upwards in a moving car -- it will come straight back down to you -- even though it's moving forward at 60 mph and you didn't throw it forward...

Nobody's complaining... I questioned it... At the time, I confused myself... It makes sense again. :)

Matt Smith
Member #783
November 2000

Quote:

someone seems to be complaining that jumping wouldn't work in simulated gravity -- which isn't true at all -- your horizontal velocity doesn't change while jumping vertically. -- Throw a ball upwards in a moving car -- it will come straight back down to you -- even though it's moving forward at 60 mph and you didn't throw it forward..

This is where coriolis force comes into play. If the radius of the spinning is too small, and thus the rate of rotation too high, then a ball will not come straight down at all. Ball games will still be possible on space habitats, but the weird gravity will give the home team the advantage.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Not if they play on a field perpendicular to the direction of rotation.

Matt Smith
Member #783
November 2000

The home team will still have the advantage, because they know how the ball spins sideways.

Surely even in American Rugby they change ends at half time.

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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America has rugby?

Matt Smith
Member #783
November 2000

Yes, it's similar to Rugby League except you are allowed to forward pass and you keep your space-suit on ;D

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