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Allegro 5 "marketing" :)
beoran
Member #12,636
March 2011

Well, it' a bike shed indeed, but I feel we're getting a better at every step. :)

I'll be going on 2 week holidays and I don't know if I'll have a good internet connection and time to use it. If I don't I'll leave it up to you guys.

Dennis
Member #1,090
July 2003
avatar

Is anyone even working on any projects utilizing A5? Just wondering... even the "The Depot" sub-forum where members talked about their projects seems to be gone.

pkrcel
Member #14,001
February 2012

I like that last, with a minor change

Quote:

Extendability and Modularity. The add-on system lets you use as much Allegro as you need, or even extend it.

I removed the "if you need to" because, as above, we should not be giving reasons to think "hey, I may ever need to extend the libray? pfft...incomplete!"

Gideon, please stay involved...your input has been very valuable IMO.

Anyway we're fairly close, short yet complete introduction.

The fact that those statements can be misinterpreted is actually a GOOD sign. :P

It is unlikely that Google shares your distaste for capitalism. - Derezo
If one had the eternity of time, one would do things later. - Johan Halmén

Elias
Member #358
May 2000

Dennis said:

Is anyone even working on any projects utilizing A5?

No. And nobody is working on the Allegro code either. This is the marketing department after all.

--
"Either help out or stop whining" - Evert

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

Elias said:

And nobody is working on the Allegro code either.

Is that true?

I'm working on my current videogame using Allegro. If the developers are abandoning the project please tell us.

MiquelFire
Member #3,110
January 2003
avatar

Elias said:

This is the marketing department after all.

That tells me it was a joke.

---
Febreze (and other air fresheners actually) is just below perfumes/colognes, and that's just below dead skunks in terms of smells that offend my nose.
MiquelFire.red
If anyone is of the opinion that there is no systemic racism in America, they're either blind, stupid, or racist too. ~Edgar Reynaldo

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

Don't scare people that way Elias >:(

SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
avatar

Allegro is a little understaffed, so we welcome help... I wouldn't say it's abandoned (or close to it). E.g. a listing of the past few months of commits:

2014-03-23  vkensou           [win] Fix for al_get_standard_path with unicode.
2014-03-20  Trent Gamblin     Make real fullscreen modes work on OS X again. May not be perfect still. Thanks SDL.
2014-03-19  Trent Gamblin     Remove some code (Android only) that was supposed to be a fix for some older Android devices that didn't support certain te
2014-03-19  Trent Gamblin     Allow adding (.exe) suffix to Raspberry Pi toolchain programs
2014-03-15  SiegeLord         Clarify what al_update_display_region does in case the driver does not support this feature.
2014-03-15  SiegeLord         Fix typo in documentation of al_wait_for_event_timed
2014-02-28  SiegeLord         Clarify the documentation of al_calculate_arc.
2014-02-25  Peter Wang        android: Set correct orientation at startup.
2014-02-23  SiegeLord         Add a collinear polyline test
2014-02-23  SiegeLord         Fix some more sharp-angle polyline drawing bugs.
2014-02-23  SiegeLord         Fix uni- and bi-directional looping of zero-length samples.
2014-02-22  SiegeLord         Fix incorrect rendering of sharp angles with thick polylines.
2014-02-17  SiegeLord         Rephrase the documentation of ALLEGRO_PRIM_QUALITY
2014-01-31  SiegeLord         Switch to using unicode windows.
2014-01-25  SiegeLord         Do not check for the D3D device being lost up to 1000 times per second.
2014-02-03  Peter Wang        cmake: Add deps folders to CMAKE_FIND_ROOT_PATH *or* CMAKE_PREFIX_PATH.
2014-02-02  Elias Pschernig   [OSX] Fixed/avoided all sound examples freezing...
2014-01-18  Ben Davis         cmake: Add deps folders to CMAKE_PREFIX_PATH, not CMAKE_FIND_ROOT_PATH.
2014-01-14  SiegeLord         Clarify that the output of al_draw_pixel doesn't get bigger/smaller when transformed
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        Bump version to 5.1.9 (GIT).
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        Bump version to 5.1.8 (WIP).
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        Prepare summary of changes for 5.1.8.
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        docs: Use tempnam instead of tmpnam in make_doc.
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        docs: Delete Windows path workaround for older versions of Pandoc.
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        docs: Add make_doc --pandoc option and use it.
2014-01-12  Peter Wang        docs: Allow for .exe suffix in pandoc version detection regexp.
2014-01-09  SiegeLord         Use the texture dimensions to compute the half-pixel shift.
2014-01-09  SiegeLord         Do not apply the half-pixel shift to proj_transform itself.
2014-01-08  SiegeLord         Move the 0.5 pixel shift into _al_hlsl_set_projview_matrix.
2014-01-08  SiegeLord         Remove #version specifier from all shaders.
2014-01-08  SiegeLord         Move the half-pixel shift in D3D into the projection matrix.
2014-01-08  SiegeLord         Add a note about vertex/index buffers being liable to fail on lower-end GPUs
2014-01-08  SiegeLord         Fix a crash in ex_prim when vertex buffer creation fails.
2014-01-07  Trent Gamblin     set _WIN32_WINNT version to Windows XP to get DirectSound 8 (Markus Henschel)
2014-01-07  Trent Gamblin     Use lazy initialization for thread local state object (Markus Henschel)

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18
[SiegeLord's Abode][Codes]:[DAllegro5]:[RustAllegro]

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

I know I have been since a while here but where is the TODO list of Allegro to see what can I do? I saw the code once and was WAY too complicated to me. But probably right now I can understand it.

Now thinking about it, I think we should reach a point where Allegro is 'complete' like for example eNet (the networking library) I use it a lot and I think they haven't changed anything since years ago and still working pretty well. Then improve other things like what people is doing know, the wiki, binaries, manuals, etc.

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

My patch was never accepted :'(...

---
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they / she

SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
avatar

I have a general TODO item that involves going through all the old patches and seeing if they could be applied or not, hah.

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18
[SiegeLord's Abode][Codes]:[DAllegro5]:[RustAllegro]

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

My patch was never accepted :'(...

Did you submit it here... or on the actual Allegro dev list?

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Polybios
Member #12,293
October 2010

Life gets in the way of trying to integrate suggestions for me. I'll try to do this when I have more time (if nobody else does).

@Gideon:
Your contribution has been valueable. Having one short paragraph of text and a short list of about 7 bullet points is a good idea.
I'm sorry if I was too harsh with my criticism.
But we should keep the facts straight.

@SiegeLord:
It's important to keep the facts straight, but there's no need for scientific precision here. ;)

Quote:

Allegro provides low-level user input and multimedia output routines

  1. "Multimedia output routines": While being precise and correct, I think it's too abstract. IMHO we should have something more concrete, more "fleshy" there.

  2. Mentioning only "Multimedia" makes me think of the 1990s. If the thing is called "Allegro low level game routines", games should be mentioned on its front page, too.

In your list, there's "API" in point 2 and 6. IMHO, there should be one point for API.

While the idea "portable speed" is nice, there should be only one point starting with "portabl...", IMHO :) Maybe simply "speed everywhere" ???

I still miss these two which I deem important:

  1. Playing nicely alongside / integrating well with "native" OpenGL and Direct3D.

  2. Freedom and control (because it's not an engine).

Maybe 1 could be integrated into "Extendability and Modularity" which could be called "Flexibility"?

Maybe 2 could somehow be merged into "Freedom".

Dennis
Member #1,090
July 2003
avatar

Elias said:

No. And nobody is working on the Allegro code either. This is the marketing department after all.

Truth.

SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
avatar

I decided to play around with Blender and recreate the original Allegro logo (bottom of http://liballeg.org/logos.html). Here's the result:

{"name":"608452","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/e\/2\/e2046624fe9661deba798b207907dc7d.png","w":480,"h":270,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/e\/2\/e2046624fe9661deba798b207907dc7d"}608452

EDIT:

And now with slightly more uniform lighting:

{"name":"608468","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/a\/8\/a83e5294881d7bd9e31a55c2379774cd.png","w":960,"h":531,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/a\/8\/a83e5294881d7bd9e31a55c2379774cd"}608468

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18
[SiegeLord's Abode][Codes]:[DAllegro5]:[RustAllegro]

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Bump.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

;D Yhea I think that keeping this thread alive is important.

I didn't want to say anything but I can't just ignore it, SiegeLord, that logo is incredible wrong. It's so 1999-ish all that glow, and lights and depth it's not used anymore these days. I still think that as an improvement and not as a final logo we should use the logo proposed by Polybios in its most simple way (whiteout the brackets) and change the logo on the wiki, allegro.cc and liballeg, if in the future we come up with something better we can change it.

SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
avatar

It's so 1999-ish all that glow, and lights and depth it's not used anymore these days.

I know, these days it's all Windows 8, boring flatness. I'm not interested in modern perversions.

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18
[SiegeLord's Abode][Codes]:[DAllegro5]:[RustAllegro]

Elias
Member #358
May 2000

I think the text is too dark, in the version with black background I can hardly read it, in the version with white background it looks almost like black text. Maybe make a version where the Allegro uses the same color as the 5. And maybe even more uniform lighting, something like global illumination instead of the hard raytraced lights...

--
"Either help out or stop whining" - Evert

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

It's not only Windows but other companies. I still remember when I liked the Windows XP GUI, now I look at it and think "Oh my god". I think it's about changing, there is nothing bad in changing.

Code::Blocks also changed their logo. They went from something like this:

{"name":"2d9eah1.png","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/b\/8\/b822184ecc9e294bd288db70a50aa5af.png","w":450,"h":240,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/b\/8\/b822184ecc9e294bd288db70a50aa5af"}2d9eah1.png

to this:

{"name":"608471","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/3\/03b32007c5799225ddc4989187795320.png","w":661,"h":283,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/3\/03b32007c5799225ddc4989187795320"}608471

The glow of the previous version was incredible amateur.

There is also Google.

{"name":"logo11w.png","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/5\/8\/58ccd552e22f0c86c64f8560e04ddc39.png","w":538,"h":190,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/5\/8\/58ccd552e22f0c86c64f8560e04ddc39"}logo11w.png

Etc, etc...

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
avatar

Elias said:

I think the text is too dark, in the version with black background I can hardly read it, in the version with white background it looks almost like black text.

Perhaps you need to check your monitor settings. The colours stand out very clearly to me, and I failed an employment test at a colour copy centre due to the fact that I can't differentiate colours well enough. So if I can see that properly, anyone should be able to.

SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
avatar

I think it's about changing, there is nothing bad in changing.

I have nothing against change... but I am quite a bit against change just because everybody else is doing it, especially if they are all going the same direction... that's called being a lemming :P.

EDIT: I just looked a bit online about this, and look what I came up upon:

http://www.webdesignerdepot.com/2013/07/flat-design-casts-a-long-shadow/

If this isn't a definition of a bandwagon, I don't know what is. Should we add a long shadow to the Allegro logo because everybody is doing it?

"For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18
[SiegeLord's Abode][Codes]:[DAllegro5]:[RustAllegro]

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Designers and Companies tend to follow trends like lemmings. I see it at work a lot. The new trend is screen size images to show one element in a list. Even on the desktop. It's retarded.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
avatar

SiegeLord said:

I have nothing against change... but I am quite a bit against change just because everybody else is doing it, especially if they are all going the same direction... that's called being a lemming :P.

When you created that image you was also being a Lemming, typical shadows, glows, depth and even colors, the problem is that you got stuck in the lemmings' tendency of the 90's. At least I'm a 2014 lemming. And yhea I like the fresh style of these new logos...

FMC
Member #4,431
March 2004
avatar

Isn't the whole point of this thread marketing? :P
One might agree about the lemming stuff, but the truth is (to me at least) that the glowing logo is shouting: "look, 1990!"
Which is not what we want to make people have a good impression of Allegro :)

[FMC Studios] - [Caries Field] - [Ctris] - [Pman] - [Chess for allegroites]
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