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linux doing well
kazzmir
Member #1,786
December 2001
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I thought it was about Left 4 Dead 2, not TF2.

http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/linux/steamd-penguins/

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Ah, you may be right. :-/ I don't like either one so they're just kind of generically in that category in my mind. Which ever. :P

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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They expanded. The beta is getting TF2, L4D and Portal IIRC.

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Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

torhu
Member #2,727
September 2002
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But could a Freetard play a proprietary game without having to kill himself afterwards? What would Holy Messiah Stallman say to such an act of blasphemy? Would he not at least require the sacrifice of a thousand Tux penguins?

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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torhu said:

But could a Freetard play a proprietary game without having to kill himself afterwards? What would Holy Messiah Stallman say to such an act of blasphemy? Would he not at least require the sacrifice of a thousand Tux penguins?

One answer, and one answer only:

WHO CARES.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

torhu
Member #2,727
September 2002
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I see you have lost you faith. Sad.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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I have never cared all that much about FREETARDS.

I like it when a company supports linux. Even if not in an optimal way to begin with. Almost anything is better than nothing. Once they get their foot in the door, we can push them in the right direction.

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Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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If it can be shown that a proprietary program won't hack my computer, I suppose it's OK, but "proprietary" kind of precludes that.

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
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I would be happier to see Linux do better. It does have a lot going for it, but it is still too young, and doesn't have enough resources dedicated to it to fully compete with Windows for me. I recently had the pleasure of working with MacOSX for the first time, and it is a fucking nightmare. Compared to Windows, it's file explorer is a piss poor excuse for system software. There isn't even a folder tree, only links to common folders like the desktop. Resizing windows is cumbersome and slow, and they don't maximize nicely without setting their size first. There's no such thing as maximizing a window on OSX as far as I can see. Icon organization is a total free for all and is hard to automatically reorganize your icons once they get out of place. The row of icons along the bottom isn't very helpful, and would never accomodate all the programs I want to use, but I suppose that is what the App button is for.

In all honesty, Windows is more organized and easier to work with than OSX, although I will say I totally love Lightroom for OSX. Is there something comparable to Photoshop or Lightroom on Linux these days?

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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I would be happier to see Linux do better. It does have a lot going for it, but it is still too young

Heh, its older than windows 95 :P

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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It'd help if the hardware manufacturers worked a little harder, and more coders were willing to do the boring stuff instead of the next sexy thing that comes along. That said, I like it better than Windows, although using Windows now is such a pain partly because I'm not used to it anymore. I'd bet a lot of Mac enthusiasts would say the same thing Edgar complained about, in favor of Mac. I've never used OSX, but I did get a headache trying OS 7 a couple times for 10 minutes each.

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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OSX is quite different from OS7 afaik. I played with OS8 or OS9 a bit, I did not enjoy it. Apparently if you change the network settings, it doesn't apply them till you reboot ::) derp?

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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All I was trying to do was install some games off the Internet, but I stuffed StuffIt. :-/

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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OS X is much different than OS 8 and OS 9 too. What doesn't apply network settings until you reboot? ???

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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BAF said:

What doesn't apply network settings until you reboot?

You're asking if there's an OS that can apply network settings without a reboot? Jeez! ::)

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

Tobias Dammers
Member #2,604
August 2002
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torhu said:

But could a Freetard play a proprietary game without having to kill himself afterwards? What would Holy Messiah Stallman say to such an act of blasphemy? Would he not at least require the sacrifice of a thousand Tux penguins?

If you're a Free Software zealot, you're not running non-free software, ever, and Steam does not change anything about that. I think Stallman's stance would be that commercial games are fine, as long as they don't violate your freedoms, but proprietary ones are not. Why would games be any different from any other kind of software? This means that Steam on Linux would be allowed only if it came with source code and guaranteed you that you could get the sources for anything you download, that anything you download and installed can be shared with anyone you like, legally, and that you can modify and redistribute anything you download, as well as Steam itself, in any way you wish (with the optional limitation that redistributed copies must be published under the same license as the original to prevent non-free redistributions).

Personally, I'm not such a zealot, but I am definitely not going to let this thing come anywhere near my "serious" partition - I trust it about as much as I trust internet porn. Most likely, once the dust settles I'll install Ubuntu on a separate hdd and use that only for gaming, or maybe I'll just stay away from gaming for a while longer.

OSX is quite different from OS7 afaik.

OS X was a rewrite from scratch and shares practically no code with OS 9, apart from the filesystem (and that too has been heavily revised I think), and the backwards-portability stuff, which is basically OS 9 running in an emulator IIRC.

OS X uses a Mach kernel (based on NeXT code), BSD userland (which makes it a UNIX for all practical considerations), and a whole bunch of proprietary stuff to make it shiny and fluffy and all that.

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Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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OS X was a rewrite from scratch and shares practically no code with OS 9, apart from the filesystem (and that too has been heavily revised I think), and the backwards-portability stuff, which is basically OS 9 running in an emulator IIRC.

OS X uses a Mach kernel (based on NeXT code), BSD userland (which makes it a UNIX for all practical considerations), and a whole bunch of proprietary stuff to make it shiny and fluffy and all that.

I was more talking about the UI and workflow differences.

But yes, it's an entirely separate OS.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
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I kind of feel like Stallman's zealotry makes companies afraid of Linux. It comes with all this elitist, anti proprietary (often confused with commercial) sentiment. Its just a huge bone-r-killer for corporate entities. :-/

I am however liking all the new swag coming out (docks, GUI control panels, and compositors), which debunks the thought that Linux is ugly and difficult to use.

Plus I just bought a printer and a webcam (from goodwill ;D): they had separate driver CDs for Vista and Windows 7... on Linux I just plugged them in and they worked immediately.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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furinkan said:

Its just a huge bone-r-killer for corporate entities.

I thought it was because there wasn't anybody to sue when things went wrong?

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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I thought it was because there wasn't anybody to sue when things went wrong?

You can always pay for RedHat and sue them ;)

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
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^ this

I really don't understand that the lawsuit argument though. What if something happens and its Windows fault (I know, that has never happened, but still)? You think your little piss-ant company is gonna sue Microsoft? ::)

Riiiiiiiiight.

You'll blow thousands in the lawsuit, and their lawyers are better than yours. Its less economical to sue Microsoft than it is to just suck it up (which is what you'd do with linux).

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Most proprietary vendors also have "ABSOLUTELY NO LIABILITY" "AS IS" clauses in their licenses so to the extent permitted by law most proprietary vendors are also immune to such lawsuits. You have to pay extra for them to take liability in your operations, and in doing so they're likely to send people to set up and keep things running smoothly. I imagine that's talking about 6 or 7 figure contracts. :)

The real reason people are afraid of open source is because (a) they aren't familiar with it and/or don't know anything about it; and (b) they are usually already cornered by vendor lock-in and think that they're satisfied with what they have.

I mean, fuck, half of the time the SQL Server instances on my development box don't come up by themselves and I have to start them manually. ::) Our administrator assures me that it happens to the production servers too. That's fucking unacceptable.

Specter Phoenix
Member #1,425
July 2001
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Don't know about it doing well, just know I like using it because most of my games won't play on it so I can't use them to avoid programming.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Samuel Henderson
Member #3,757
August 2003
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Quote:

I mean, , half of the time the SQL Server instances on my development box don't come up by themselves and I have to start them manually. Our administrator assures me that it happens to the production servers too. That's ing unacceptable.

Are you sure that it's not something you guys are doing? We switched from Oracle to MS SQL Server a couple of years ago and have never looked back.

=================================================
Paul whoknows: Why is this thread still open?
Onewing: Because it is a pthread: a thread for me to pee on.

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