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I give up. |
bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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type568 said: Did you play any Starcrafts? Never. -- acc.js | al4anim - Allegro 4 Animation library | Allegro 5 VS/NuGet Guide | Allegro.cc Mockup | Allegro.cc <code> Tag | Allegro 4 Timer Example (w/ Semaphores) | Allegro 5 "Winpkg" (MSVC readme) | Bambot | Blog | C++ STL Container Flowchart | Castopulence Software | Check Return Values | Derail? | Is This A Discussion? Flow Chart | Filesystem Hierarchy Standard | Clean Code Talks - Global State and Singletons | How To Use Header Files | GNU/Linux (Debian, Fedora, Gentoo) | rot (rot13, rot47, rotN) | Streaming |
BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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bamccaig said: Video games generally require mental effort, and some even require physical effort. Writing programs usually requires even more mental effort. Watching a movie is relatively relaxing, assuming you don't care too much about what it is you're watching (personally, my mind is pretty busy when I'm watching a movie, and I expect anybody watching one for the first time would also be busy taking it all in). Usually when I leave a movie theater I'm all "fired up", the furthest thing from relaxed. Driving a car is clearly not relaxing. It also requires physical and mental effort. These things are enjoyable (for many people), but usually not relaxing. All of those things are relaxing to me. I never let myself get that stressed out, but I wouldn't even bother to do most of those things if it wasn't relaxing. Quote: Or you could be like every other guy and just not flush. Aim at the sides, not at the water, and you won't get splashed. You're not touching it so it's not going to hurt you (except for the smell, but generally that's the least of your worries in a washroom). It's not rocket science. If you think that's bad, women's washrooms are statically much worse. You still get splashed... |
Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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I can tell when posts become two pages long that we've really lost our ability (as a whole) to keep a rational discussion. My main points are: Points 1 and 2 are verified enough by the following BBC article: BBC said: It is estimated that air pollution - of which vehicle emissions are the major contributor - is responsible for 24,000 premature deaths in the UK every year. Many of these deaths are due to asthma, bronchitis and other respiratory diseases - all of which are known to be aggravated by exposure to car fumes. A Dutch study of 632 children aged 7 to 11 years found that respiratory disorders worsened as air pollution increased and a longer term study of older Dutch residents, published in 2009 found that illness due to lung disorders increased in areas of high nitrogen dioxide and particulate matter associated with exhaust emissions. [correction] -----sig: |
Samuel Henderson
Member #3,757
August 2003
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bamccaig said: Yeah, I know. Starcraft II Marines are quite a bit different. Firstly, the back story of Starcraft implies that the majority of marines are convicts who are only suited up and fighting because it beats sitting in a prison cell. <ontopic> ================================================= |
bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Samuel Henderson said: Starcraft II Marines are quite a bit different. Firstly, the back story of Starcraft implies that the majority of marines are convicts who are only suited up and fighting because it beats sitting in a prison cell.
Was type568 talking about marines in the game or in real life? -- acc.js | al4anim - Allegro 4 Animation library | Allegro 5 VS/NuGet Guide | Allegro.cc Mockup | Allegro.cc <code> Tag | Allegro 4 Timer Example (w/ Semaphores) | Allegro 5 "Winpkg" (MSVC readme) | Bambot | Blog | C++ STL Container Flowchart | Castopulence Software | Check Return Values | Derail? | Is This A Discussion? Flow Chart | Filesystem Hierarchy Standard | Clean Code Talks - Global State and Singletons | How To Use Header Files | GNU/Linux (Debian, Fedora, Gentoo) | rot (rot13, rot47, rotN) | Streaming |
Vanneto
Member #8,643
May 2007
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Chris Katko said: I can tell when posts become two pages long that we've really lost our ability (as a whole) to keep a rational discussion.
Lost it? You have to have it to lose it. All discussions end like this on Allegro.cc. There was never a rational discussion. Just back and forth, everybody jibber-jabbering. In capitalist America bank robs you. |
SiegeLord
Member #7,827
October 2006
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Quote: It is estimated that air pollution - of which vehicle emissions are the major contributor - is responsible for 24,000 premature deaths in the UK every year. That's a critical number to know for smoking for comparison. My cursory research shows that this number can be much higher depending on what you consider to be death from smoking. I'd like you to find the number so there is a consistent bias. "For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increases knowledge increases sorrow."-Ecclesiastes 1:18 |
Vanneto
Member #8,643
May 2007
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My grandfather has stopped smoking 40 years ago. He died of lung cancer. Was it because of his smoking or was it just random? How do you differentiate between the two? Quote: Over 443,000 Americans (over 18 percent of all deaths) die because of smoking each year. Secondhand smoke kills about 50,000 of them. OK, how do you get those numbers? How do you decide the cancer was caused by smoking? Another one, how do you decide someone has died of second hand smoking? This is even more puzzling. In capitalist America bank robs you. |
Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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Why do you have to compare death numbers? As long as both are significant amounts, both are significant things to consider for your overall health. However, I just found evidence contrary to my thoughts: wikipedia said: Environmental tobacco smoke (ETS) has been shown to produce more particulate-matter (PM) pollution than an idling low-emission diesel engine. In an experiment conducted by the Italian National Cancer Institute, three cigarettes were left smoldering, one after the other, in a 60 m³ garage with a limited air exchange. The cigarettes produced PM pollution exceeding outdoor limits, as well as PM concentrations up to 10-fold that of the idling engine.[51], And I'll give them that. But I am suspect about their use of a "low emission diesel engine" instead of typical gas or diesel engine with 100,000 miles of wear on it. My bias detector is ringing until I finish reading exactly how they conducted their research. (Engine wear and upkeep is very important to what we're addressing here.) This also does not consider any load applications, but merely idling. To follow that up: Quote: Accordingly, it has been shown that ETS and diesel exhausts share many common chemical components such as hydrocarbons, aldehydes, nitric oxides, carbon dioxide, and carbon monoxide, and have similar PM emissions, composed primarily of particles , 2.5 mm in diameter. So they are comparable. They compared 3 cigarettes to an idling 2.0 liter "ECO" turbodiesel in good condition. Most cars (in the USA) are not 2.0L turbodiesels. They're large gasoline engines in cars, and larger diesel in trucks. They're also not in good upkeep and the article even states that these contribute much more of the total volume of pollution. Quote: It has been estimated that older gasoline vehicles and light duty diesel emission rates are on average 100 times higher than those of newer vehicles, and that cars and trucks manufactured from 1991–1996 currently account for only 3.8% of PM pollution, as compared to 26.8% caused by cars built from 1986–1990. So at this point, we know many people die every year from pollution caused directly by cars. And we also know that most people don't think twice about it. So doesn't my original point that people "over-react" to cigarettes (since you won't die from one) and "under-react" to car exhaust (because you don't think at all) hold water? -----sig: |
bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Chris Katko said: So doesn't my original point that people "over-react" to cigarettes (since you won't die from one)...
Except that people do die from diseases caused by smoking cigarettes... And many people also die from long-term exposure to second-hand cigarette smoke. Chris Katko said: ...and "under-react" to car exhaust (because you don't think at all) hold water? Again, the difference is that while people generally don't seal themselves in a garage with a running engine (indeed, any commercial garage should have exhaust hoses and fans), people do regularly seal themselves (and others) in a room with lit cigarettes. I don't believe that I've inhaled as many poisonous gases from car exhaust as cigarette smoke (and there were times in my youth when I would intentionally stand behind a car that was warming up in the winter I'm sure I've been exposed to enough exhaust to have done some harm, but not nearly as much harm as my exposure to 20 years worth of cigarette smoke has done. -- acc.js | al4anim - Allegro 4 Animation library | Allegro 5 VS/NuGet Guide | Allegro.cc Mockup | Allegro.cc <code> Tag | Allegro 4 Timer Example (w/ Semaphores) | Allegro 5 "Winpkg" (MSVC readme) | Bambot | Blog | C++ STL Container Flowchart | Castopulence Software | Check Return Values | Derail? | Is This A Discussion? Flow Chart | Filesystem Hierarchy Standard | Clean Code Talks - Global State and Singletons | How To Use Header Files | GNU/Linux (Debian, Fedora, Gentoo) | rot (rot13, rot47, rotN) | Streaming |
Samuel Henderson
Member #3,757
August 2003
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type568 said: Append: CIggaret for the win. In some video in original Starcraft a marine lifts up his "windshield", and it's all in smoke inside there cos' of a cigar. And that's damn cool!
type568 said: While in a total war for complete annihilation versus a brutal alien race, while injecting reflex stimulating drugs in your veins to fire-n-run faster, you do not care about the health damage the pathetic ciggaret may deal, especially in such a far future, where the med science has somewhat advanced. Besides you're under mental pressure, and this cigga' may just keep you in shape mentally. I assure you, that there are antidepressants out there, which are hella worse than a cigga'. However, did anyone notice they kept their drinks in the ice with the bomb? Gotta be somewhat against the rules, I also won't be too surprised it's all beamed with radiation, accordingly to the seals of the bomb.. Should be kinda rad-proof.. And it's also cool!
Quote: Ooh, and my private additional reason for the coolness, is cos' I saw it for the first time while I was.. 10? yr old, just finished some mission vs the evil Zergs and earned me a new kewl cinematic
bamccaig said: Was type568 talking about marines in the game or in real life? Looks like he was mostly referring to the marines in Starcraft. He did mention soldiers in Iraq, but that was more about having a potentially unhealthy lifestyle probably due to circumstances... ================================================= |
james_lohr
Member #1,947
February 2002
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Getting back to the original argument, I'm really struggling to see what you are crying about. The Barbarian class is a Warrior class as far as I'm concerned. Could you explain what out-of-context definition you are applying here to get yourself so worked up? As to "cartoonish", I don't see what you're getting at here either. Maybe you don't like the above average quality of the animation? - in which case I think you'll just have to deal with the fact that Blizzard can afford the best animators, and so they may as well use them.
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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OP reminds me of this ... {"name":"20080806.jpg","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/1\/c\/1c78622ba43c58d19dd47fd92b69089f.jpg","w":750,"h":376,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/1\/c\/1c78622ba43c58d19dd47fd92b69089f"} -- |
Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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Chris Katko said: People vilify cigarettes and don't even notice car exhaust. Car accidents kill more people than guns, but you don't hear people crying to eliminate cars as a result. That's because so many people have one that it makes it OK somehow. A minority doesn't stand a chance of being left alone. They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas. |
Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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You're looking at the percentages wrong.
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Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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The Wikipedia page on "List of causes of death by rate" shows that lung cancer just barely beats out auto accidents, by less than one percent. [EDIT] And when passengers in a car die, aren't they victims of "second hand death-by-accident"? Think of the children! They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas. |
Trezker
Member #1,739
December 2001
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Well there's not much point in arguing about car exhausts since we'll automatically be rid of them some time this century. At least most of them. Unless biofuel takes over most of the fuel market ofcourse, I don't know how dangerous that is... |
Vanneto
Member #8,643
May 2007
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Matthew Leverton said: 86.7% of smokers die of lung cancer. How do you determine if a cancerous tumor is caused by cigarettes? In capitalist America bank robs you. |
BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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IT JUST IS! |
Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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Vanneto said: How do you determine if a cancerous tumor is caused by cigarettes? Of that 86.7%, 94.1% were directly due to smoking. |
Vanneto
Member #8,643
May 2007
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Oh, I get what you did there. I wont bite this time. In capitalist America bank robs you. |
Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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James Lohr said: The Barbarian class is a Warrior class as far as I'm concerned. Could you explain what out-of-context definition you are applying here to get yourself so worked up? Warriors (in Diablo) cast magic. They're knights. They're not walking brutes. There's a sense of intelligently calculated death handed out by them. Barbarians are brutes who run around and smash things. They burn women and rape Churches. It's like the incredible Hulk. Boring. "Hey! What did he do?" "He smashed him." "What about the last time?" "He smashed him." "And the time before that?" "He smashed him." I was dissapointed in Diablo 2. I'm completely uninterested in Diablo 3's comic revamb for reasons I've already stated. bamccaig said: Except that people do die from diseases caused by smoking cigarettes... And many people also die from long-term exposure to second-hand cigarette smoke. Yes! But you're missing the point! The point is that you react to that danger. You do not react to the danger of car exhaust! You even said you stand in front of it in the winter! Quote: Again, the difference is that while people generally don't seal themselves in a garage with a running engine (indeed, any commercial garage should have exhaust hoses and fans), people do regularly seal themselves (and others) in a room with lit cigarettes. I've already cited an article that implies that doesn't matter. Smog wouldn't exist if pollution didn't exist, and the BBC article already stated that people die all the time due to pollution caused illnesses. Quote: I don't believe that I've inhaled as many poisonous gases from car exhaust as cigarette smoke How are you going to compare something you weren't trained to pay attention to, to something you've been told you're whole life to be afraid of? Quote: 20 years worth of cigarette smoke has done. If you're around 20 years of cigarette smoking, well clearly you're going to have significant problems from that over car exhaust. But most people here bump into a smoker a couple times a day maximum. They however spend a good portion of their day driving, walking near cars, and in the volume of pollution from cars. If you want an example of air pollution, take the Great Smokey Mountains. Pollution in the Smokies said: Degraded scenic vistas: The spectacular overlooks for which this park is known are severely impaired by human-generated polluted haze. Under natural conditions, views extended for more than 100 miles. Because of air pollution, however, park visitors can expect to see only 25 miles on average. This drops to an average of approximately 14 miles during the summer months, making the Smokies one of America’s haziest parks.
{"name":"smokies4.jpg","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/9\/a\/9a71ddb5616b27c6a729acfe54cde6a1.jpg","w":430,"h":85,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/9\/a\/9a71ddb5616b27c6a729acfe54cde6a1"} Quote: The good, the bad, and the ugly: Great Smoky Mountains National Park, visual range of Cerlulean Knob at 155 miles, 31 miles, and 6 miles. (NPS photos) There are relatively zero cars in the Smokey Mountains. But that pollution came from somewhere! So we have a place with almost no locally produced pollution, and end up with pollution. How much more so will your local town or city be at the source of the pollution? -----sig: |
bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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I think that it's safe to say that compared to the pollution that the local steel plant produces, cars are a relatively negligible source (in my area). Of course, everybody that lives downwind of it is fully aware of the air pollution. You can't not be. There's a noticeable drop in air quality most days as you pass through the west-side of town, at least in my experience. I would say that living in that area is probably going to have a major effect on a person's health over the course of 20 years, but I can't say whether it would be worse than smoking (or being regularly exposed to second-hand cigarette smoke) for that same duration. -- acc.js | al4anim - Allegro 4 Animation library | Allegro 5 VS/NuGet Guide | Allegro.cc Mockup | Allegro.cc <code> Tag | Allegro 4 Timer Example (w/ Semaphores) | Allegro 5 "Winpkg" (MSVC readme) | Bambot | Blog | C++ STL Container Flowchart | Castopulence Software | Check Return Values | Derail? | Is This A Discussion? Flow Chart | Filesystem Hierarchy Standard | Clean Code Talks - Global State and Singletons | How To Use Header Files | GNU/Linux (Debian, Fedora, Gentoo) | rot (rot13, rot47, rotN) | Streaming |
type568
Member #8,381
March 2007
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Regarding the marines- I mentioned both SC2 marines & U.S, though those in SC2 have their conditions severely worse, hence they have a kind of justification to smoke. Besides they smoke cigars, not cigarettes. Matthew Leverton said: 86.7% of smokers die of lung cancer Lies.
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Trezker
Member #1,739
December 2001
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If a smoker doesn't die from lung cancer, he's not doing it right. |
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