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Newest versions not easy to set up
Joe larson
Member #10,200
September 2008
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4.4.1 and 4.9.x are missing the make files and fix.bat. The precompiled binaries for mingw are for ver 3.3 (I'm using 3.4.5). The allegro team has failed to make this easy for new folks to get into like they did in the past. This isn't good guys.

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
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It's still in beta.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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It's not missing them. Allegro has switched to CMake. Read the instructions, then come back with valid comments and/or questions.

Joe larson
Member #10,200
September 2008
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Alright then. There are multiple conflicting instructions online. It's difficult for a new user to get a grip on how to do set up. Allegros biggest draw is how easy it is for new users, but changing the way it gets set up but not changing the instructions for setup sends mixed signals.

Maybe I've just caught things in a weird point, and I don't mind that. I just wanted to make the dev team aware.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

Of course there are ~15 years of incompatible Allegro tutorials on the Internet that pre-date Allegro 4.4/4.9. The Allegro development team is only responsible for the instructions that come with the library. Those instructions are kept up-to-date.

Anyway, when 5.0 is ready, there will be binaries for the popular platforms. Most people won't have to bother with compiling Allegro, so I wouldn't really worry about anything.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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I remember getting stuck on the instructions saying to mkdir build, then cd build, then something about parent directory (which I missed) for cmake command.

“Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded — here and there, now and then — are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty. This is known as "bad luck.”

― Robert A. Heinlein

Karadoc ~~
Member #2,749
September 2002
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The only thing I don't like about the CMake system is that it means I have to install CMake - which I don't intend to use for anything other than compiling Allegro.

There may well be conflicting sets of instructions about how to install Allegro, but I found it easy enough to just follow the instructions that are included in the download. I wouldn't look for other instructions unless I got stuck. There is definitely room for improvement though.

-----------

Dustin Dettmer
Member #3,935
October 2003
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Hm, CMake should offer a bundlable binary.

AMCerasoli
Member #11,955
May 2010
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The allegro team has failed to make this easy for new folks to get into like they did in the past.

That is true man... I spend a lot of time learning new things this time, and i made a videotutorial for the community... but no one know it (the videotutorial)...

This is the Link: Installing Allegro 4.9.19 With Binaries

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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Why are so many people so afraid of new things? Seriously, it isn't hard. It might be tedious if you plan to build all the dependencies yourself, but if all you want is allegro then you can SKIP them ALL. And if you do, the building is similar to how it was before. Just it uses CMake instead of hand rolled makefiles, and autoconf.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Dario ff
Member #10,065
August 2008
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and i made a videotutorial for the community... but no one know it

You can always put it on Youtube. It's likely to be searched more easily. Or you can make an article in the Wiki, but there is a good amount of them right now.

About getting it to be "easy", some things people should understand:
- It's still in beta. The devs might start making easier tutorials when the amount of dependencies needed is defined, and even if CMake is going to be used as the final build system.

- Likely, the 4.9 branch is hard to setup on Windows AFAIK. As Matthew already said, binaries will likely be distributed for the most common compilers. If conflicts like this happen:

the precompiled binaries for mingw are for ver 3.3 (I'm using 3.4.5).

then new binaries will be released.

TranslatorHack 2010, a human translation chain in a.cc.
My games: [GiftCraft] - [Blocky Rhythm[SH2011]] - [Elven Revolution] - [Dune Smasher!]

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
avatar

Seriously, it isn't hard.

Quote:

Just it uses CMake instead of hand rolled makefiles, and autoconf.

I don't know what any of those are! Or why that makes any kind of difference to me!

Quote:

but if all you want is allegro then you can SKIP them ALL.

I don't want to have just allegro. I want to make games! I'm not interested in learning a build system and configuring makefiles with cmake folder build environment blabadie bloops subsystem platform altercations. That's what I see. Building things is a whole other language.

Quote:

Why are so many people so afraid of new things?

I'm not afraid of it. I just don't want to have to learn all the ins and outs of a system of which I only need to accomplish one thing.

It's just frustrating, Thomas. You talk about it and it seems easy to you because you understand the process. I don't. It's not something you can just pick up.

And I'm not a noob. I've been using allegro for more than 5 8 years now. Every time it comes time to build, it's a pain in the ass. There's always 50 steps and 50 switches and readmes and downloads and version conflicts. Not to mention when you can finally get it to work, there's that looming feeling that you didn't do it right and there's something wrong with the build that's going to come up later and bite you in the ass.

I'm sorry, I'm grumpy. I had some bad pizza. :P

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

I don't know what any of those are!

Then how did you ever build Allegro 4? :o On windows it used hand rolled (evil) makefiles, and on unix, it used autoconf to generate a configure script which generated makefiles.

Quote:

I don't want to just have allegro. I want to make games! I'm not interested in learning a build system

Thats too bad. you'll either have to learn it, or wait till someone builds a binary for you, which could take some time.

Quote:

It's just frustrating, Thomas. You talk about it and it seems easy to you because you understand the process. I don't. It's not something you can just pick up.

I didn't know CMake prior to allegro picking it up. I didn't learn CMake till well after allegro switched to it actually. So obviously it is something you can just pick up. I'm not the brightest bulb in the box you know.

Quote:

And I'm not a noob. I've been using allegro for more than 5 years now.

But you act like one. If you're afraid to learn new things, you're not going to get very far, very fast.

Either stick with the binaries that people put up eventually, or learn how to actually build allegro. Those are the only two choices.

Building Allegro with all of its addons is actually easier that it was before. Now that we include many addons, they use the same build system, and build with allegro. Before you had to go download a bunch of separate packages, all of which used a separate hand made build system which you'd have to learn separately, and build them all separately. All you have to do now is tell cmake where the source is, where the build dir is, and hit "generate", then you just type "make", or in the case of MSVC, load up the newly generated .sln file.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Dario ff
Member #10,065
August 2008
avatar

It's not something you can just pick up.

Wait wait, what CMake version are you using? There's a very easy to use GUI version.

EDIT: You don't really need all addons. I could care less for flac support, so I don't build it. :P

TranslatorHack 2010, a human translation chain in a.cc.
My games: [GiftCraft] - [Blocky Rhythm[SH2011]] - [Elven Revolution] - [Dune Smasher!]

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
avatar

Dario ff said:

Wait wait, what CMake version are you using? There's a very easy to use GUI version.

Exactly!! Apparently there's are versions I shouldn't be using?! CMake isn't a program that I usually use. People don't know these things. :D

All you have to do now is tell cmake where the source is, where the build dir is, and hit "generate", then you just type "make", or in the case of MSVC, load up the newly generated .sln file.

Alright! Let me just do that. ;D Since that's 'all' I have to do.

  1. Downloading Source.

  2. Downloading CMake.

    1. assuming the Windows Installer version is the one I want

  3. Installing CMake

    1. clicking "add CMake to the system PATH for all users" (That sounds like something that could screw me)

  4. Opening CMake GUI

    1. creating a new build folder

    2. picking the "Visual Studio 9 Generator" since I just happened by the information that the VS10 version doesn't work correctly, and I should instead be using the 9 generator.

    3. Trying to build

    4. Fail

  5. What Information do I need to know? All I have at this point is "It doesn't work." I'm completely in the dark. I even tried all the other MSVC Generators (the poking in the dark technique).

Please bear with me. I'm actually in a really goofy mood. ;D

Quote:

I'm not the brightest bulb in the box you know.

Now that's not true. I've read some of your source code for the Canva5 lib.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

On Windows, Allegro 4.2 came with MSVC project files that you open up and click build. There's nothing evil about that. It works every time with no fuss.

Allegro 5 is more difficult to build for MSVC, and I wouldn't recommend any average user to even bother doing it. (It's not like it's extremely hard, but it's an unnecessary evil.)

Under Linux, it's hardly a nuisance at all.

What Information do I need to know? All I have at this point is "It doesn't work." I'm completely in the dark. I even tried all the other MSVC Generators (the poking in the dark technique).

I never use the GUI version. It doesn't ever seem to work.

Open MSVC's Command Prompt.

  • set LIB=%LIB%;c:\path\to\third\party\libs

  • set INCLUDE=%INCLUDE%;c:\path\to\third\party\headers

  • cd allegro

  • mkdir build

  • cd build

  • cmake .. -G "Visual Studio 9 2008"

Laugh at all the missing dependencies.

Open MSVC project file. Build.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

What Information do I need to know? All I have at this point is "It doesn't work." I'm completely in the dark. I even tried all the other MSVC Generators (the poking in the dark technique).

It looks to me like you haven't setup MSVC properly? CMake seems to be complaining that it can't find MSVC 2008. But since I don't use MSVC, I really can't help much.

Quote:

Now that's not true. I've read some of your source code for the Canva5 lib.

Oh come now, its nothing fancy. In fact I'm pretty sure I'm doing some if it horribly wrong ;D Got some major bugs to fix in the way transformations are handled. And figure out a way to "clip" to arbitrary shapes, rather than right angled quadrilaterals (squares and rectangles ;D).

On Windows, Allegro 4.2 came with MSVC project files that you open up and click build. There's nothing evil about that. It works every time with no fuss.

Allegro 5 should probably come with one as well.

append:

Please bear with me. I'm actually in a really goofy mood. ;D

No problem :) so long as you don't take my grouchiness too seriously.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
avatar

It looks to me like you haven't setup MSVC properly?

Exactly!! Apparently there's some way I shouldn't be setting up MSVC?! ;D So, now "build allegro" is "figure out all the millions of possible things that could be wrong with your MSVC install with the looming feeling that it might have nothing to do with the problem." That's the definition of something that's a pain in the ass :P

I never use the GUI version. It doesn't ever seem to work.

Exactly!! ;D :P

OK... Back to seriousness.

What are these lines:

set LIB=%LIB%;c:\path\to\third\party\libs
set INCLUDE=%INCLUDE%;c:\path\to\third\party\headers

Are these the libraries that Allegro requires to build? Do I need to get these from another place and build them? (And, this is allegro 5, right?)

Seriously, though. I've gone this far. I'm energized. I'm goin' all the way. 8-)

Need some theme music:

video
:P

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
avatar

It's not something you can just pick up.

You don't need to know how to use cmake, really. You just need to know how to follow the instructions that come with A5. I've built several of the 4.9.x builds (and 4.4) and I don't really know how cmake works.

Under Linux, it's hardly a nuisance at all.

It's very easy under Windows as well if you use MinGW.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

Are these the libraries that Allegro requires to build? Do I need to get these from another place and build them? (And, this is allegro 5, right?)

Yes. I put all the third party libraries (e.g., dumb.lib) in a single lib folder outside of my main MSVC lib folder. I think it's easier to keep organized that way.

Then if CMake knows to look there (via the LIB variable), they will be detected during the cmake process.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Exactly!! Apparently there's some way I shouldn't be setting up MSVC?! ;D So, now "build allegro" is "figure out all the millions of possible things that could be wrong with your MSVC install with the looming feeling that it might have nothing to do with the problem." That's the definition of something that's a pain in the ass :P

Theres a reason I don't use MSVC at all.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
avatar

LennyLen said:

It's very easy under Windows as well if you use MinGW.

I was using MinGW and Code::Blocks before MSVC, but MSVC is so nice (the IDE, I mean). All the other environments I've used don't come close.

Then if CMake knows to look there (via the LIB variable), they will be detected during the cmake process.

So, I'm assuming I could build the "vanilla" allegro without having to set the LIB and INCLUDE paths at all? I don't want to get ahead of myself so I'll try that first.

Aaaannnnd fail:

Setting environment for using Microsoft Visual Studio 2010 x86 tools.

c:\program files (x86)\microsoft visual studio 10.0\vc\bin>cd/

c:>cd users

c:\Users>cd mark

c:\Users\Mark>cd desktop

c:\Users\Mark\Desktop>cd allegro

c:\Users\Mark\Desktop\allegro>mkdir build

c:\Users\Mark\Desktop\allegro>cd build

c:\Users\Mark\Desktop\allegro\build>cmake .. -G "Visual Studio 9 2008"
-- Check for working C compiler using: Visual Studio 9 2008
-- Check for working C compiler using: Visual Studio 9 2008 -- broken
CMake Error at C:/Program Files (x86)/CMake 2.8/share/cmake-2.8/Modules/CMakeTes
tCCompiler.cmake:52 (MESSAGE):
  The C compiler "C:/Program Files (x86)/Microsoft Visual Studio
  10.0/VC/bin/cl.exe" is not able to compile a simple test program.

  It fails with the following output:

   Change Dir: C:/Users/Mark/Desktop/allegro/build/CMakeFiles/CMakeTmp



  Run Build Command:C:\PROGRA~2\MICROS~1.0\Common7\IDE\VCExpress.exe
  CMAKE_TRY_COMPILE.sln /build Debug /project cmTryCompileExec



  Microsoft (R) Visual C++ 2010 Express Version 10.0.30319.1.

  Copyright (C) Microsoft Corp.  All rights reserved.



  Solution file
  'C:\Users\Mark\Desktop\allegro\build\CMakeFiles\CMakeTmp\CMAKE_TRY_COMPILE.sln
'
  is from a previous version of this application and must be converted in
  order to build in this version of the application.  To convert the
  solution, open the solution in this version of the application.



  CMake will not be able to correctly generate this project.
Call Stack (most recent call first):
  CMakeLists.txt:30 (project)


-- Configuring incomplete, errors occurred!

c:\Users\Mark\Desktop\allegro\build>

I really don't know how to interpret any of those error messages.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

Use -G "Visual Studio 10" instead.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Use -G "Visual Studio 10" instead.

Isn't that supposed to not work due to CMake making broken VS 10 projects?

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Dario ff
Member #10,065
August 2008
avatar

Apparently there's are versions I shouldn't be using?!

That's not what I said. :P The GUI version is just easier to use. ML says it doesn't work sometimes, that hasn't happened to me so far. But who knows.

TranslatorHack 2010, a human translation chain in a.cc.
My games: [GiftCraft] - [Blocky Rhythm[SH2011]] - [Elven Revolution] - [Dune Smasher!]

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