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Car Tune Up
BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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This is a post meant for the few on a.cc who know what they are talking about with cars. ;)

Basically, what should be done in an engine overhaul/tune up? My celica has a (Toyota) 5S-FE engine, if that helps at all. Not much as far as maintenance has been done on the car (before I got it), and all I've done is dumped some fuel injector cleaner in the gas tank, done an oil change, and put a new air/oil filter in.

The car idles a little rough and sometimes feels like it has a lack of power. I'd think a tune up would help this situation out (there's nothing wrong with the engine aside from a small oil seep, which should be fixable by changing a gasket or something). Also, is it possible to adjust automatic transmissions at all? Something seems to shift aggressively, and usually it shifts before reaching 2500 rpms (unless I manually shift down or turn off overdrive), which also seems to cause crappy acceleration.

I'm not sure what could be done to tune up the engine to make it run a little better (some googling led me to taking the injectors out and having them cleaned at a dealership or garage, tightening up the throttle assy a little bit, and some other stuff like that).

General tips and advice are appreciated. I'll give cookies too. :)

le_y_mistar
Member #8,251
January 2007
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Post in a car forum, i bet you'd get better advice from car nuts.

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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I figured it was worth posting here first, because we have at least a couple people knowledgeable about cars, at least it appears that way from the Deathwish threads we get into. ;)

kronoman
Member #2,911
November 2002
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I would go first changing oil, spark plugs and air cleaner.

That worked great on my mom´s car. Was running like crap, and with those 3 simple things, started running great again.

You can do it on your garage (except for the oil change, well, you can, but what are you going to do with around 5 lts of old oil? better change it at gas station)

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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The ones already mentioned plus spark plug cables and fuel filter. A bad set of spark plugs is quite often the source of bad running. I replaced mine and now it feels like the engine (XU9J2, 125hp/177Nm) has 10hp and 20Nm more. If the car feels like it stutters when accelerating, replace the fuel filter. A clogged fuel filter drops fuel pressure in the supply rail (while increasing pressure on the pump side, stressing it unnecessarily) and fuel flow rate. That can cause lean burning, which can ultimately lead to the pistons melting.

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Rampage
Member #3,035
December 2002
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Whatever you do, first make sure that your brakes can handle the improved speeds.

-R

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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It's almost due for an oil change again and the air cleaner is only a few months old. I'll put a new spark plugs in next oil change (in a few weeks), and a new fuel filter.

And my brakes are good, so they can handle it. ;P

Matt Smith
Member #783
November 2000

Are you old enough to drive on public roads yet? My, how time flies ::)

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Is there anything more you can tell us? What year is the car, how long have you had it, what's the mileage, how did the previous owners treat it, what general condition is the car in, etc.?

???

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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I forgot one important thing from the previous post:

Quote:

Also, is it possible to adjust automatic transmissions at all?

DO NOT TOUCH IT! Take it to a proper mechanic. Automatic transmissions operate on half good faith and half black magic - that is to say they're too complicated devices for non-professionals.

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piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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if your lacking power that was there before. i would check the exsues system and the timing belt they have the most to do with power.

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jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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No, that would be the crankshaft, connection rods, pistons, cylinder liners and cylinder head. All the others are just accessories for those. :)

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Steve++
Member #1,816
January 2002

Yeah, you'll certainly know if the exhaust is leaking. As for the timing belt, if it's one notch out either way, the engine could theoretically run, but it would be as gutless as anything. So I doubt that's the problem. If you're not going to replace the spark plugs just yet, at least pull them out and give them a good clean. You can actually tell quite a lot about how an engine is running from inspecting its plugs, so have a look. You can supposedly tell if the engine (or a particular cylinder) is running too lean or rich, so perhaps that's a good way to tell how well the injectors are working.

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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well i took my Toyota Celica 1990 to shop the shop to get the timing belt change. when after i took after i took for test drive i told them it run but it dose not have the same power it used to have. then they redone the timing belt and it worked like a charm.

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jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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You don't deserve my sig.

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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Quote:

Are you old enough to drive on public roads yet? My, how time flies ::)

Yes, I have been for just over a year.

Quote:

Is there anything more you can tell us? What year is the car, how long have you had it, what's the mileage, how did the previous owners treat it, what general condition is the car in, etc.?

Well.. it's a 1990 Celica GT, I've had it almost a year, it has about 142,000 miles on it, it was treated well and maintained (except I guess it (hardly?) never got new plugs or anything, according to what they said). It's in very good condition, and was garaged for a while.

Quote:

DO NOT TOUCH IT! Take it to a proper mechanic. Automatic transmissions operate on half good faith and half black magic - that is to say they're too complicated devices for non-professionals.

I didn't know if it was a small tweak. Would tightening the throttle cable help at all as I read on a thread I found with Google?

One thing to note is that as the gas tank gets below a half a tank, you can feel a loss in power. If you go fill up the gas tank, it feels a lot more powerful.

The engine runs fine, just idles rough and, it's powerful enough, but it feels like it shifts before it hits the good power.

So, the general consensus seems at the moment to put new plugs in and see what that does?

[edit] I went outside to check stuff and it started raining again. I did look at the throttle real quick before coming back in. I'm not sure how it works, but there's a small wheel type thing, one cable on top, one on bottom (presumably cruise control?). The bottom cable is tight, but the top one has a little bit of slack. Should that be tightened to take the slack out via the adjustment?

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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Quote:

One thing to note is that as the gas tank gets below a half a tank, you can feel a loss in power. If you go fill up the gas tank, it feels a lot more powerful.

Could be a crack in the fuel intake tube inside the tank or your fuel pump is its way out (the hydrostatic pressure of a full tank forces more fuel to the pump)

Quote:

I went outside to check stuff and it started raining again. I did look at the throttle real quick before coming back in. I'm not sure how it works, but there's a small wheel type thing, one cable on top, one on bottom (presumably cruise control?). The bottom cable is tight, but the top one has a little bit of slack. Should that be tightened to take the slack out via the adjustment?

The wheel type thing is the throttle cable wheel, which the throttle cable rotates and which in turn rotates the throttle butterfly inside the throttle body.

If the cables both go in the same direction but on different sides of the wheel i'd guess the other cable actuates the kickdown. Or you could have a motorcycle-style dual throttle cable system which i doubt since i've never seen one on a car before. Usually there shouldn't be much slack in any throttle cables, however the throttle butterfly should rest on its stop, the cable shouldn't exert any force on the wheel at idle.

If they go in opposite directions (i.e. both cables would rotate the wheel in the same direction) then i'd be inclined to believe the other one is indeed for cruise control.

edit: See the attached image: Do you have the cables set up as if you had two of same color or one of each color?

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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Quote:

Could be a crack in the fuel intake tube inside the tank or your fuel pump is its way out (the hydrostatic pressure of a full tank forces more fuel to the pump)

It's done this from day one, but is there an easy way to see which it could be (without pulling the tank out to look at it)?

Quote:

If the cables both go in the same direction but on different sides of the wheel i'd guess the other cable actuates the kickdown. Or you could have a motorcycle-style dual throttle cable system which i doubt since i've never seen one on a car before. Usually there shouldn't be much slack in any throttle cables, however the throttle butterfly should rest on its stop, the cable shouldn't exert any force on the wheel at idle.

If they go in opposite directions (i.e. both cables would rotate the wheel in the same direction) then i'd be inclined to believe the other one is indeed for cruise control.

The cables are both on the same side of the wheel, one on top, one on bottom. They both rotate the wheel in the same direction, so I guess my guess on cruise control is correct.

There is a small amount of play on the cable, more so on the one on top than the one on bottom. The throttle rests at it's stop but I'm not sure how much i'd be able to tighten up the cable without exerting force.

[edit]
I'm not sure how the bottom cable is routed, but I'd say it my system resembles the orange cable on the left, and the blue cable on the left (but the blue cable follows more of an orange path).

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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Quote:

but is there an easy way to see which it could be (without pulling the tank out to look at it)?

I wouldn't know, it depends how they manufacturer has intended these things to be looked at.

For them to be throttle and cruise control cables they'd need to be on opposite sides or travel in quite an unusual configuration - the curved arrows demonstrate direction the wheel would turn if the cable of same color (straight arrows) would be pulled (in the direction of the arrow obviously). You should trace the cables to see where they go.

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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I'll go out and check after it stops raining some, or tomorrow, whichever comes first.

I don't know if anything can be found on google by searching for the car, but it's a 1990 Toyota Celica GT coupe, auto tranny, and I 99% sure it has the 5S-FE engine.

Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

Quote:

One thing to note is that as the gas tank gets below a half a tank, you can feel a loss in power.

If the gas pump is weak it sucks. No, it doesn't. :P
As jhuuskon pointed out, the full tank helps with the pressure. But an empty tank might do the opposite. Do you notice a "Swooosssh" sound, when you open the cap to the tank? I used to have that sound on my Toyota Carina 1991, before rust made small cracks in the tank and the filler neck. I recently replaced the neck. Couldn't stand the gas smell, when I filled up the tank. I got back the swoosh sound. Now it's gone again.

Anyway, when pump sucks gas, it develops a great underpressure in the tank and that sucks!

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Bob Keane
Member #7,342
June 2006

If you are replacing the spark plugs and wires, you might take a look at the distributor cap as well. It couldn't hurt to replace it. As for the transmission, mine slipped the first few weeks I had the car, after replacing the spark plugs, the problem went away. Most likely unrelated, or may have been the engine being out of synch with the transmission due to the plugs.

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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I hear a swoosh if the tank is below about a half a tank too.

Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

Thank God! I thought I had become crazy.

Try to just open and close the cap (and enjoy the sound) and drive on. Do you get the power back without adding fuel?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Years of thorough research have revealed that the red "x" that closes a window, really isn't red, but white on red background.

Years of thorough research have revealed that what people find beautiful about the Mandelbrot set is not the set itself, but all the rest.

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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It seems to get power back after I let the pressure out, but I haven't test driven it yet.

Also, jhuuskon, the throttle wheel has the throttle cable actually on bottom, and when you open the throttle up it pulls on the top cable.

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