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Free Electricity
Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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I think you mean underestimating, and no he isn't.

--
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"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Bob
Free Market Evangelist
September 2000
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Quote:

bob what your saying is that energy that force gravity produces is less then that heat energy that is lost.

Correct. A portion of the energy produced will be in the form of kinetic energy (moving stuff around) by reducing potential energy. The rest will be turned into heat due to friction.

Quote:

it sound like you completely undermining gravity

Not at all. Try dropping a heavy mass from a flying airplane. Even if you compensate for altitude reducing the gravitational force, the acceleration you'll get on your mass will always be slighly less than the acceleration from gravity, because of friction.

--
- Bob
[ -- All my signature links are 404 -- ]

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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i c. when exams are over im going to build it and post it here working or not.

wow
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i am who you are not am i

Elverion
Member #6,239
September 2005
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Quote:

Quote:
Don't for get we are using a pulley which also reduces the amount of energy the is needed to raise the ball.
Pullies don't reduce the needed energy to lift anything.

Not only do pullies not reduce the energy needed, they increase it. That's right. Pullies require you to put more energy into lifting; they just make the work easier, not less.

I have not been able to see this YouTube video yet, but based on the descriptions I gather from responses, it sounds impossible. First, with the magnets, I assume they are used to pull magnetic balls up some sort of incline, then drop them? Well, that wouldn't work, because the ball (at best) would travel towards the first magnet, and then stick when it was at the point on the include closest to the magnet. These sort of systems have been proven to not work. With the gravity/heat issue, I think you are misunderstanding what Bob is saying, piccolo. It is not that heat is a stronger force than gravity, just that it is a loss. Read Newton's Laws on energy conservation. Lets say there were 100 units of energy gained from dropping the ball...It would require X amount of energy to lift the balls again, plus you have loss from friction(heat) and other forces (and remember, gravity is fighting against you here now! -- it would take 100 units of energy to counteract gravity). The combined energy gained would be less than the net loss of energy, and hence, you are losing more energy than gaining. The Mythbusters built several machines that demonstrated this.

--
SolarStrike Software - MicroMacro home - Automation software.

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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weird the down time seems to be only for that vid
bush saw it and though it will mess up his oil funds

edit this still work http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1woSe6UB0c8

and you can see the other on though web page link at the first post

wow
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i am who you are not am i

Derezo
Member #1,666
April 2001
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Just buy a perpetual motion machine on EBay!

I imagine that the required AA batteries are charged..... yeah.. ;)

"He who controls the stuffing controls the Universe"

HoHo
Member #4,534
April 2004
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Quote:

Fact.
Nature has all the answers
Natures Perpetual Wheel
Water in the sea evaporates to clouds.
Clouds travel over land, and rains.
Rains form rivers.
Rivers run back into the sea.
Humans build a dam in the river.
Electricity.
It's not very different from mine!
Heavy balls = water
Pulley system on the left = river
Pulley system on the right = evaporates to clouds
Brake = Dam
Electricity.
Nature has ALL the answers, we simply need to look.
Fact.
Yes, there can also be a reservoir of heavy balls = the sea, and the balls rolling left = clouds and the balls falling after rolling left = rain.

Too bad he forgot the part Sun has in evaporating the water and creating winds :)

[edit]
Also he forgot that accelerating things faster (moving one ball up at high speed) uses a lot more energy than accelerating them slower (moving balls down at slow speed).

I have a terrible toothake and it's not fun to do some math in this situation but a simple calculation can show that balances out.

__________
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is - Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
MMORPG's...Many Men Online Role Playing Girls - Radagar
"Is Java REALLY slower? Does STL really bloat your exes? Find out with your friendly host, HoHo, and his benchmarking machine!" - Jakub Wasilewski

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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Either piccolo is trolling or just has more eagerness than intelligence.

All forms of man-usable energy on this planet, and I do mean every single form except nuclear power, can be traced back to the sun. Even wind power. And fossil fuels. Everything except nuclear power.

You don't deserve my sig.

HoHo
Member #4,534
April 2004
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Well, technically even nuclear power can be traced back to stars. After all, these elements were formed in stars by using their thermonuclear and gravitational power :)

Also that thermonuclear power is not endless. In the end, quite a lot, if not all of the mass will be converted to radiation. Converting radiation back to mass is not that simple.

__________
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is - Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
MMORPG's...Many Men Online Role Playing Girls - Radagar
"Is Java REALLY slower? Does STL really bloat your exes? Find out with your friendly host, HoHo, and his benchmarking machine!" - Jakub Wasilewski

kikabo
Member #3,679
July 2003
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Quote:

All forms of man-usable energy on this planet, and I do mean every single form except nuclear power, can be traced back to the sun. Even wind power. And fossil fuels. Everything except nuclear power.

and except these

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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Hydrothermal vents are nothing but vents that heat water by geothermal energy, and geothermal energy in turn is the result of heat generated during the formation of the planet. Which in turn wouldn't have happened without the sun's gravitation, so we can attribute that to the sun as well. ;)

Though you are right there that it isn't energy collected from the sun, but the gravitational pull of the incoming matter converted to heat during earth's formation.

You don't deserve my sig.

Kibiz0r
Member #6,203
September 2005
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That perpetual motion machine won't work. It's a closed system and there is friction involved, so energy is constantly lost to friction until it comes to a stop.

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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i am very sup prized at the replys i got from every one. normally programmers would not respond this way. programmers work problems out and believe no problem is unsolvable.

wow
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i am who you are not am i

HoHo
Member #4,534
April 2004
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Most programmers also know basic physics :)

__________
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is - Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut
MMORPG's...Many Men Online Role Playing Girls - Radagar
"Is Java REALLY slower? Does STL really bloat your exes? Find out with your friendly host, HoHo, and his benchmarking machine!" - Jakub Wasilewski

CGamesPlay
Member #2,559
July 2002
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And to think that the answer has been staring us in the face all this time!

{"name":"picminiball2.jpg","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/a\/a\/aa9f8c7d9f9af2b14e7160aa15c45f3d.jpg","w":594,"h":462,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/a\/a\/aa9f8c7d9f9af2b14e7160aa15c45f3d"}picminiball2.jpg

piccolo: Good luck. When you finish exams you can get the parts here ;D

[edit]
This site has pictures of a working implementation.

--
Tomasu: Every time you read this: hugging!

Ryan Patterson - <http://cgamesplay.com/>

gnolam
Member #2,030
March 2002
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Ahh... magnets. If you align them just right, you'll get free energy! Honest!
(For extra points, add some technobabble about "quantum effects" and "harmonies")

jhuuskon said:

Either piccolo is trolling or just has more eagerness than intelligence.

The latter has already been established.

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Move to the Democratic People's Republic of Vivendi Universal (formerly known as Sweden) - officially democracy- and privacy-free since 2008-06-18!

piccolo
Member #3,163
January 2003
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I'm not intelligence i'm smart and clever. intelligence just means you have stored knowledge. smart people know how to use knowledge the get.

wow
-------------------------------
i am who you are not am i

Bob
Free Market Evangelist
September 2000
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Quote:

programmers work problems out and believe no problem is unsolvable.

This is untrue. Some problems are proven to be unsolvable (such as perpertual motion machines). Thus, trying to solve them is a complete waste of time.

--
- Bob
[ -- All my signature links are 404 -- ]

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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Quote:

intelligence just means you have stored knowledge. smart people know how to use knowledge the get.

It's a shame that your knowlede doesn't include how to use a dictionary. If you did have this knowledge, you'd know what intelligence means.

Having "stored knowledge" is wisdom.

Jonatan Hedborg
Member #4,886
July 2004
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Ack. This thread makes me want to bash my head against a wall.
It reminds me of a thread on gamedev years ago with a guy who claimed he had created a compression routine which had an efficiency of over 130%! It was surprisingly long-winded for something so obviously wrong.

Piccolo, you need to read up on some (very) basic physics and thermodynamics (it's not as hard as it sounds) and then come back with your head hanging in shame.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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You can get free electricity from slaves and animals.

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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Quote:

You can get free electricity from slaves and animals.

Feeding them is such a chore. The best way to get free electricity is to steal your neighbours'.

Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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piccolo: Conservation of energy is "a mathematical consequence of the shift symmetry of time; energy conservation is implied by the empirical fact that physical laws remain the same over time". Any system (i.e. more than one body interacting) that is moving loses energy every time the different bodies interact because every real-world object has at least some elasticity and here on earth there are further costs of air resistance, friction, etc.

Therefore, if it is possible to create a perpetual motion machine then maths as presently understood is wrong. That means you can't rely on any sort of scientific explanation (such as a comparison of the force of gravity to the weight of other objects) unless you can explain how you fix the error you've flagged up in the currently understood system of maths.

EDIT:

Quote:

The best way to get free electricity is to steal your neighbours.

What, and then hold them to ransom?

Billybob
Member #3,136
January 2003

Who's more foolish? The fool, or the people trying to teach the fool ...

Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
avatar

Quote:

Who's more foolish? The fool, or the people trying to teach the fool ...

Supposing it's the people trying to teach the fool then you really look foolish for that comment!



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