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| Revolution controler unveiled... |
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CGamesPlay
Member #2,559
July 2002
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I can imagine someone now who said: I shall kick your ass at Super Smash Borthers Circle Edition.... with one hand behind my back!
-- Ryan Patterson - <http://cgamesplay.com/> |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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The 1up article was very enlightening. Read it in its entirety before commenting! I'm extremely surprised (as I'm sure we all are) but after careful deliberation I'm delighted to see game control finally moving in a different direction. --> |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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I personally will definitely avoid a Revolution for this reason. Besides being restricted to one button, the thing that worries me most is the red cross taped to the floor so that users stood in the right place. I'm sure it'll be lots of fun being punished by the games machine for having moved a little too much during play. This feels more Virtua Boy than DS to me. Quote: People teased Nintendo when they previewed the N64 pad, and now every pad has an analog joystick, even though it was taboo since Atari times. Anybody who owned a PC already had an analogue joystick port, I expect many had analogue joysticks - apparently undeterred that they hadn't surfaced on other computers for about 10 years. [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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The X was there because what was shown was a demo, and it showed the maximun distance, not the exact point. That is, you were able to go nearer, but not farther than that cross, according to reviews. For your next statement, I quote myself ;-) Nintendo fanboy said: I just don't understand how people can play (in example) Half-Life using WASD for movement and the mouse to aim and shoot, and won't be able to use Nintendo controller.
-- |
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Zaphos
Member #1,468
August 2001
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Quote: From time to time I like playing laying on my front, weight on the ellbows. Which won't be possible using this device. You can still rotate your wrist from this position, so I imagine it would work for most games. The 1up article even mentioned that a calmer, resting position was more effective for the metroid prime demo. Quote: Besides being restricted to one button, It isn't ... Quote: Anybody who owned a PC already had an analogue joystick port, The N64 pseudo-analog joystick was quite different in usage from anything I think existed for the PC, so it is still something I would call innovative.
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Quote: I just don't understand how people can play (in example) Half-Life using WASD for movement and the mouse to aim and shoot, and won't be able to use Nintendo controller. At the end of the day, a good interface is one that stops feeling like an interface so that from that point on you don't think "I want to move left - that means... the A key - I'll press the A key" but instead just "I want to move left - I am moving left". The means of communication stops entering your conscious mind. The true test of the Nintendo controller will be how well it is able to do that but the test the market will apply is whether it looks stupid. Which it does. For my money, I see it becoming uncomfortable for more than short periods of play. Which will completely defeat any control transparency. The market is also usually hostile to this sort of thing - for example towards the Sega Activator or almost any of the various fishing controllers. How many people do you know that have one? Of course it is nonsensical to ask how the games we are used to will be adapted to the thing because that really isn't what it is for. With that in mind I don't see the Revolution as a gaming device as we currently understand them. Consider trying to play International Superstar Soccer on it, or even any existing Mario game. As that isn't going to happen, the Revolution is simply not a product targetted at me or at most of the existing game market. I expect Nintendo will open up their own unique little market for this and continue being what they are now - a profitable but unimportant little company remembered for being a bully when it used to be a giant. Quote: The N64 pseudo-analog joystick was quite different in usage from anything I think existed for the PC, so it is still something I would call innovative. Well it wasn't innovative in that nothing like it had been seen before, but it's fair enough to say that the earlier efforts had not caught a mass market audience - so it was an innovative application of an existing idea. See, e.g. the Voltmace sticks for the Acorn computers - which even included a proper ADC converter for their joystick rather than a PC style quick, but incredibly clever, hack. What's probably more interesting is how quickly Nintendo's quick idea appeared on the other consoles. No doubt if the Revolution controller works then it's general ethic won't be a Nintendo exclusive idea for long. [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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Of course, as a developer, if you're uncomfortable crafting your game to take advantage of the rev controller, you can always take the banal route and use the gamecube ports on the top of the console. It's not like you're locked into using the funky nunchaku controller. --> |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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But will the thing ship with a Gamecube controller, or will you simply be cutting off 90% of Nintendo's already terminally declining market share? A funny quote from Nintendo, courtesy of the BBC: "If we can't [convert new users to gaming who were scared off by the fast pace of existing games], we might as well stand back and watch the market die off" - Nintendo boss Satoru Iwata. Typical Nintendo, confusing their fiefdom for the entire market! [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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I don't know you, but from experience:
Like it or not, Nintendo is the only one that takes risks. NES, Game Boy and SNES worked. Virtual Boy and N64 didn't. Nintendo knew they were not going to lead the market with GC, but instead they developed a console to have profit, and it worked. The GBA SP worked, the GB Micro seems to be working quite fine in Japan. Nintendogs worked, with over 1.5m copies sold around the world (and without European and Australian releases). The DS, like it or not, worked. For the health of the game industry, I hope Revolution will work. I don't want, as I see now, that all the games GC, PS2 and XBOX get have also a PC port. -- |
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Morten Bendix
Member #1,386
June 2001
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Well, if you want a more old school type gameplay: 1up article said: turn the controller 90 degrees and it becomes just like an old 8-bit NES joypad, with the D-pad under your left thumb and "a" and "b" under your right.
My initial reaction was "WTF!?" too. But then I read the articel and now I think I'll have to start saving... no, start getting a job is more like it! |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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Quote: But will the thing ship with a Gamecube controller, or will you simply be cutting off 90% of Nintendo's already terminally declining market share? And stopping by a shop to pick up a controller is some sort of herculean task? For some reason that didn't stop the millions of PS2/Xbox/Cube owners who happily went out and grabbed another controller (or three) when they needed one. --> |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Quote: If Microsoft becomes the leader, you would probably use the same XBox360 for 6 years until a little company creates their FireBox console and they are forced to update it. I hope you enjoy stagnation! Is this an oblique reference to Nintendo's 1991 pronouncment that they didn't intend to bring the SNES to Europe for a few years because they thought the 8bit market still had a lot of life in it? Of course they quickly reversed that little idea, surprising as it was given that they probably never made a profit with the NES in Europe anyway. Quote: Like it or not, Nintendo is the only one that takes risks. NES, Game Boy and SNES worked. NES: didn't work in Europe. Well known for maintaining dominance using illegal measures, such as locking third party companies into not producing the same titles for other consoles for two years and for tight control over who was allowed to produce how many copies of what and how many titles they could bring to the market in a year. Game boy: came to market after the Atari Lynx. The Lynx design was complete and ready to be shipped in 1987 at which point it was shown to various industry insiders and bought by Atari who cleverly sat on it for two years. SNES: Sega had a 16bit console. NEC claimed to have one. Nintendo made one. Which was good, because otherwise who would have been innovative enough to remove the blood from Mortal Kombat or cleverly sign deals for a CD addon with two separate big multinationals then release neither? Quote: And stopping by a shop to pick up a controller is some sort of herculean task? No it's not. But if a console comes with one particular controller and is marketed around that controller with most of the first party titles (which are all that really matter on Nintendo consoles now anyway) being designed exclusively for that controller do you suppose that controller or the legacy support for the old style controller will be more prevalent amongst users? [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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Carrus85
Member #2,633
August 2002
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I wonder if they will release a wireless version of the analog joystick addition... that would reduce a lot of the "strain" potentially caused by that dinky cord. Also, I was wondering, there is a power button in the upper left of the controller. When you rotated it to play old-style games, wouldn't that be kinda err... dangerous? (as in, you might hit the power button accidently?)
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Morten Bendix
Member #1,386
June 2001
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Carrus85 said: When you rotated it to play old-style games, wouldn't that be kinda err... dangerous? (as in, you might hit the power button accidently?) I think the power button is indented in the controller so you would probably just slide over it. I was thinking the same thing about the analogue stick. |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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Quote: No it's not. But if a console comes with one particular controller and is marketed around that controller with most of the first party titles (which are all that really matter on Nintendo consoles now anyway) being designed exclusively for that controller do you suppose that controller or the legacy support for the old style controller will be more prevalent amongst users? Irrelevant. The point I made was that developers have the option to use the more conventional gamecube controller if they so desire, and I've gone so far as to suggest that rev owners would be happy to acquire a cube controller (assuming they don't already have one) if they need one. The ball is entirely in the third party court as to which controller they go with, but the choice is there. --> |
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Jakub Wasilewski
Member #3,653
June 2003
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Quote: (as in, you might hit the power button accidently?) Well, I think that the console will require you to confirm the shutdown if you do that in the middle of a game (i.e. not in idle mode). At least that would be a good decision in my opinion. --------------------------- |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Quote: Irrelevant. The point I made was that developers have the option to use the more conventional gamecube controller if they so desire, and I've gone so far as to suggest that rev owners would be happy to acquire a cube controller With all due respect, my arguments concerning how readily Revolution owners are likely to buy Gamecube controllers sounds entirely relevant to your discussion which includes the concept of how happily Revolution owners will feel buying Gamecube controllers. I don't know, maybe it's a language barrier thing. Quote: Well, I think that the console will require you to confirm the shutdown if you do that in the middle of a game (i.e. not in idle mode). At least that would be a good decision in my opinion. I just hope that standby isn't akin to standby on existing televisions/videos, i.e. still using something like 70% of the power of being fully switched on. We're already heading for an oil crisis, you know. [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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Oh, I suppose that's a distinct possibility. Go figure. --> |
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MiquelFire
Member #3,110
January 2003
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It's also possible that the GameCube ports (including memory card slots) are not available for use with Revolution games. We just don't know. --- |
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spellcaster
Member #1,493
September 2001
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The test the ,aerket will aplly is not really "does it look stupid". The market will take a look at the controll say "ooooooooooah?" then look at the graphics and puy the PS3 which they wanted to bu anyway, because the advertisment told them so. -- |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Quote: It's also possible that the GameCube ports (including memory card slots) are not available for use with Revolution games. We just don't know. That's true. Who could have guessed that a PS2 would require a PS1 memory card for saving from PS1 games? EDIT: Quote: The test the ,aerket will aplly is not really "does it look stupid". The market will take a look at the controll say "ooooooooooah?" then look at the graphics and puy the PS3 which they wanted to bu anyway, because the advertisment told them so. Yeah, like that time they embraced New Coke, it having had a strong media launch. [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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Carrus85
Member #2,633
August 2002
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Quote: Well, I think that the console will require you to confirm the shutdown if you do that in the middle of a game (i.e. not in idle mode). At least that would be a good decision in my opinion. True... but still, that would be dang annoying, especially if it was relativly easy to push. Perhaps there will be a way to tell the revoltion not to respond to "remote" shutdown commands during a game?
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ReyBrujo
Moderator
January 2001
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Remember, it is a prototype, the final version, as Mr Iwata said, may change. The control will have a Power switch, but it may be hidden below a small slider. Or, most likely, you will need to keep it pressed for a couple of seconds. Remember, Nintendo controls are known to be reliable. Even the GC control, which at first may scare, is considered one of the best of all times. -- |
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Sirocco
Member #88
April 2000
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Quote: It's also possible that the GameCube ports (including memory card slots) are not available for use with Revolution games. We just don't know. Indeed, but that seems highly doubtful. Doing so would instantly negate a major selling point to third party developers: control options. Although Nintendo has done some rather idiotic things in the past... we'll just have to see. Quote: The test the ,aerket will aplly is not really "does it look stupid". The market will take a look at the controll say "ooooooooooah?" then look at the graphics and puy the PS3 which they wanted to bu anyway, because the advertisment told them so. Don't drink and type, kids! Sorry, I had to say that. --> |
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Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Quote: Don't drink and type, kids! No, you might spill some. Also remember: it's only binge drinking if you don't do it every day. [My site] [Tetrominoes] |
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