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If it's true, you don't believ in the afterlife.
jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

Polybios said:

Truth must be that people are actually getting work done on their many amazing A5 projects instead of spamming on the forums. 8-)

Yup, that's exactly what's happening
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Trent Gamblin
Member #261
April 2000
avatar

Doesn't surprise me. SDL is the only one on the list (what is C++ anyway?) that is relevant to what Allegro is. Are you suggesting we make an HTML framework? ;D.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

If A5 could somehow work with asm.js I think that would give the library a huge advantage over competitors.

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
avatar

As I mentioned a long while ago, I used A5 for a command line utility. It functions beautifully. I'll always come to Allegro with my game needs.

I'm sorry that I haven't had time to contribute! I'm trying not to break while I complete my degree, plan for a wedding, and run my company.

I appreciate every second that has been put into this project by the devs and patchers. This marks about 8 years of enjoyment from this library and community!

Chris Katko
Member #15,821
December 2014
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furinkan said:

and run my company.

How's that going? What's the details? Is it (game) programming related?

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
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@Chris: Sadly no, it isn't game related. I write software for local companies to get me through school. Since you're doing development too, hit me up on LinkedIn[1] (that goes for everyone)! I described it a little better there.

I'm buying my partner out and reestablishing the company as a worker-owned cooperative. I hope to create an environment where we can pay competitively and where the devs really matter. I believe that having your whole team genuinely care about the company is superior to paying your team to feign caring about the company. I also have no desire to make money off of my peers; I want all my dev friends to profit in proportion to their skill and effort. Worker-owned is the only way to go in my book. ;D

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

LinkedIn Said:

You and this LinkedIn user don’t know anyone in common

You can only view the profiles of users within your network. However, as you add connections, you may discover people you know in common.

:(

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
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Ugh. Dammit LinkedIn! Quit being a douche! What ever happened to forums, where you could talk to people and never even know their names?

Dizzy Egg
Member #10,824
March 2009
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My name is Dizzy. I am Egg.

The thing that killed A5 for me was the last Speedhack. It was shoddy, poorly run, no-one was interested, apart from myself and the other contributors (ahem, E'th) I just thought "what's the point".

Leverton didn't seem that arsed, and the 'usual contributors' didn't bother offering much opinion.

So, like, yeah. Up yours. Anyway, more music on the way.

Love you :D

----------------------------------------------------
Please check out my songs:
https://soundcloud.com/dont-rob-the-machina

MiquelFire
Member #3,110
January 2003
avatar

This been bugging me, why did everyone think it wasn't possible for bamccaing to get a girlfriend?

---
Febreze (and other air fresheners actually) is just below perfumes/colognes, and that's just below dead skunks in terms of smells that offend my nose.
MiquelFire.red | +Me
Windows 8 is a toned, stylish, polished professional athlete. But it’s wearing clown makeup, and that creates a serious image problem. ~PCWorld Article

Dizzy Egg
Member #10,824
March 2009
avatar

Because of bam's posts! We all thought.....man....

----------------------------------------------------
Please check out my songs:
https://soundcloud.com/dont-rob-the-machina

MiquelFire
Member #3,110
January 2003
avatar

I'm going to blame my poor memory, but I don't really remember anything that would make me think that.

---
Febreze (and other air fresheners actually) is just below perfumes/colognes, and that's just below dead skunks in terms of smells that offend my nose.
MiquelFire.red | +Me
Windows 8 is a toned, stylish, polished professional athlete. But it’s wearing clown makeup, and that creates a serious image problem. ~PCWorld Article

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
avatar

I'm going to blame my poor memory, but I don't really remember anything that would make me think that.

While it's probably not intentional, generally whenever he has talked about women in the past he has come off as a crazy misogynistic stalker.

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Sirocco said:

I'm done here. You can continue doing things the same way and continue sliding into irrelevance, or you can make a change.

Like what? Create UnityPro? Or maybe turn it into a Javascript only lib? Give us some options. What do you think Allegro should be? And if that is what you want, why haven't you helped drive change?

One thing I think has hurt in the past is the community. It can be abrasive at times. I've heard more than one person complain about it.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
avatar

Like what? Create UnityPro? Or maybe turn it into a Javascript only lib? Give us some options. What do you think Allegro should be? And if that is what you want, why haven't you helped drive change?

One thing I think has hurt in the past is the community. It can be abrasive at times. I've heard more than one person complain about it.

I agree that Allegro must change to survive. Our niche is going away, and we haven't found a new one. We must target a new demographic! 2D games are often considered less impressive than 3D ones by consumers. There are higher level (easier) solutions for n00bs. Most hobbyists build on frameworks using higher level languages than C/C++.

@Sirocco: I disagree that support of a given platform is the responsibility of our (volunteer) maintainers! >:( I don't even have a Windows box, and you'll never get my ass to supply a Windows patch. Sorry, but that's the way volunteers are.

pkrcel
Member #14,001
February 2012

furinkan said:

Ugh. Dammit LinkedIn! Quit being a douche! What ever happened to forums, where you could talk to people and never even know their names?

Just share your public profile instead of your own private, that might allow us to connect.

ANYWAY:
I really don't uderstand the sentiment for which Allegro5 has done something wrong...the wrongness being "not being SDL".

Allegro has unfortunately a small comnunity behind which coincidentally is not extremely productive in terms of game output, but apart from that it still is a low level library, and has a very specific target.

The "game changer" (if ever) could be following Beoran's suggestion about pushung to a more active release cycle (even thou it could impact code stability in terms of API) AND putting up the "nightlies" build server for several platform.

It is unlikely that Google shares your distaste for capitalism. - Derezo
If one had the eternity of time, one would do things later. - Johan Halmén

furinkan
Member #10,271
October 2008
avatar

@pkrcel: Sigged it. Do connect! My profile is lonely! ;D

I feel like publicizing A5 projects would go a long way. It is hard to say what a library can do until you see what is being built on it. Sadly, we don't have much to publicize at the moment...

Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
avatar

Back when the 4.9 wips were going, I convinced people to make more releases, and it DID help. We got more new people, and I think more A4 people migrated as well, and people who felt they needed to go to SDL or something else decided A5 was better.

--
Thomas Fjellstrom - [website] - [email] - [Allegro Wiki] - [Allegro TODO]
"If you can't think of a better solution, don't try to make a better solution." -- weapon_S
"The less evidence we have for what we believe is certain, the more violently we defend beliefs against those who don't agree" -- https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/592870205409353730

Trent Gamblin
Member #261
April 2000
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I convinced people to make more releases

Really?

(rhetorical question, don't answer)

Onewing
Member #6,152
August 2005
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If it's any consolation, I love you all, in a totally anonymous way. :-*

------------
Solo-Games.org | My Tech Blog: The Digital Helm

Dennis
Member #1,090
July 2003
avatar

So... is there an official TODO list anywhere and what do I need to do to get write/commit access to the GIT repository? (I sent a patch to the developer mailing list a few days ago but it seems it is being ignored so I would like to be able to apply patches myself in the future if it is not too much to ask.)

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
avatar

The thing that turns me off in A5 is returning structs for colors (?) instead of simply allocating and initializing an RGBA struct, possibly in global memory. Otherwise it's all good.

“Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded — here and there, now and then — are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right-thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating, or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty. This is known as "bad luck.”

― Robert A. Heinlein

beoran
Member #12,636
March 2011

Allegro isn't a Javascript library, and neither is it a 3D library. It's a C library mainly aimed at 2D games on modern systems, although it can be used as the foundation of more complex engines. It's not the old allegro 4 CPU blitting anymore, everything is hardware accelerated. Our 2 main competitors are SDL and SFML.

All other ways to develop games, from unity over click and play to Javascript in a browser are not what Allegro is about or should try to be. Allegro is low level game routines and that is fine. It's true that the general market for game developers has shifted, and nowadays, even people who are not hardcore C programmers can make games with easier to use systems. But that ease of use always comes at the espense of complecity, loss of performance, and the "engine effect" where all game made with engine X look and feel similar to each other. Allegro is for C programmers who want to make their own engine, an easy to port low level abstraction over what the hardware qnd operating system and it's GUI environment provide.

The reason I proposed Github is because I see for other open source projects that it makes it easier to contribute and easier to get into a fast development mode though the pull requests, cloning and merging. Sourceforge is fine for hosting the web page, but I feel it's a much slower, less convenient place to contribute.

This is what I think is the best plan: make it easier to contribute, make releases more often, and make a build server for easier binary releases. Even the linux kernel has dropped the old fashioned "stable and unstable version" release model, I think we should do the same. And all contributors, please go over the road map in the wiki and decide what features are desirable and which ones aren't. And be open to other low level features not mentioned that people are willing to implement and contribute.

Trent Gamblin
Member #261
April 2000
avatar

Dennis, I've seen your patch. I haven't tested it yet and I haven't ever used the video addon and don't have FFMPEG compiled so I haven't tested it. If I ran Linux I would test and apply it but I fear compiling FFMPEG on Windows is going to be a huge ordeal. I will write down right now that I have to reboot to Linux and test your patch (I'm sure it's fine but I don't commit anything without testing it.)

I can't give you commit access just yet. If you continue providing patches and they are all well and good, eventually you can gain commit access.

Erethar
Member #15,753
October 2014

beoran said:

The reason I proposed Github is because I see for other open source projects that it makes it easier to contribute and easier to get into a fast development mode though the pull requests, cloning and merging.

As someone who only started programming a few years ago, I got my chops in a world where Github is pretty much the de-facto standard.

Sure, when you're working locally with Git it doesn't really matter where the repo is, but I think it would make the project a lot more visible, plus a lot more natural for new contributors to get started.

For one, Git issues would be a much more formalized way to organize bugs and work that needs to be done. It also seems like it would also be easier to fork and manage pull requests, which I think would be cleaner than sending patches or requiring access to the main repo.

Not criticising your current dev flow, just giving my two cents :).

Dennis said:

only had to fix one undeclared symbol due to it having finally been removed from ffmpeg

Are you talking about AVCODEC_MAX_AUDIO_FRAME_SIZE? Just tried to build on Archlinux and ran into that.



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