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Fake out (This trick would not work on me)
superstar4410
Member #926
January 2001
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Don't take yourself too seriously, but do take your responsibilities very seriously.

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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AHM KILCKIN ITS NOT WERKIN

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superstar4410
Member #926
January 2001
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Hulu ur hurting me, ok Youtube ur up http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckpNYhlMipA

Don't take yourself too seriously, but do take your responsibilities very seriously.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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I was thinking "meh, it's only football, my inner geek's offended" but then I watched it ;D.

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

superstar4410
Member #926
January 2001
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Glad it made you smile

Don't take yourself too seriously, but do take your responsibilities very seriously.

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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That was pretty funny. I'm glad they had the annotations though, or I wouldn't have had a clue what was going on.

Onewing
Member #6,152
August 2005
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That's pretty funny.

Although not legal, one time, when I was young and playing basketball, we were way behind with little chance of coming back and the coach (who happened to be my dad), decides to put six players on the floor (once again, totally against the rules). Anyway, he tells us to move around a lot so it's not obvious we have an extra man. Slowly, we started coming back up on the score. ;D

Eventually, a ref realized what was going on and ordered somebody to sit on the bench. We ended up losing, but it was still a lot of fun.

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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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That trick play is old. A more common variation is for the coach to yell something like "You've got the wrong football." The quarterback then says something about switching the ball, the center gives him the ball, and then he casually walks over to the coach. Then, of course, as he nears the sidelines, he just runs for a score.

It's horrible sportsmanship. In fact, the coach (and parents) would cry bloody murder if the defenders all simultaneously jumped on the QB as he "walked off" the yards.

Anyway, while talking about trick plays. My favorite fake punt ever attempted in the NFL:

video

It was an exhibition game, but it was still funny to see.

And a good fake punt out of the field goal formation:

video

type568
Member #8,381
March 2007
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What are the typical scores in American football? I mean in soccer one ball is pretty much determining, and difference in 2 balls almost never ends up with a defeat.. I'm just curious how much does such a fake affect the match.

Append: I remember touchdown is something about 7, and catching it there is 3?

So what are typical scores of team which are of the same level?

OICW
Member #4,069
November 2003
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Seen all videos and didn't know what the hell is going on. Though the first one was at least against fair-play.

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Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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OICW said:

Though the first one was at least against fair-play.

Confusing the defense is fair play and important. It would have been slightly illegal under NFL rules, however.

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"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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type568 said:

What are the typical scores in American football?

A touchdown is worth six points. It's scored whenever a player has possession of the ball in the opponent's end zone. Doesn't matter if you catch the ball or run with it.

Immediately after scoring a touchdown you get one more play from two yards out. Most teams will then opt to attempt a field goal, which is where somebody holds the ball on the ground for the placekicker who attempts to kick the ball through the goal posts. If successful, you get an extra point. A miss is very rare at the professional level, so a touchdown ends up typically resulting in seven points.

Or optionally, you can try to score a second touchdown. If successful, you get two points. Professional teams usually only attempt that if they are losing by a margin where the extra two points could be the difference between a loss or a tie. At the high school level, it's more common, because teams often don't have anybody who can kick reliably.

If you kick a field goal without scoring a touchdown first, you get three points.

If you tackle an opponent in their own end zone, you get two points, which doesn't happen very often.

Scores in the NFL vary a lot. It depends on the style of play. Good teams average over 30 points a game. Most games are fairly competitive, usually with scores in the mid 20's or upper teens.

OICW said:

Seen all videos and didn't know what the hell is going on.

American football is broken up into discrete plays. The play begins when the center "snaps" the ball (gives it to another player, usually by tossing it backward between his legs).

You have four tries to gain ten yards. If you fail to make it, you give the ball up at that spot to your opponent. i.e., Their offensive players and your defensive players then take the field. They get the ball, and try to gain yards in the other direction.

Because of that, on your fourth down (try), teams will nearly always do one of two things: punt the ball or kick a field goal.

Punting the ball is simply kicking the ball as far as you can. The other team still gets possession of the ball, but they now have much farther to go than if you were to fail to attempt to gain your ten yards.

If you are close enough (usually within 40 yards of the endzone), then you would probably opt for a field goal to score three points.

In my first video, the blue team is getting ready to punt the ball. The punter pretends like he's going to kick the ball (the other team is trying to block it down), then pretends to give the ball to the player running behind him, and then takes off running for a touchdown. Since it's fourth down, if he doesn't make it at least 10 yards (in that play, the 30 yard line), they would have to give the ball back to the other team.

You'd never see that play in a game that counted. It's a completely ridiculous thing to try.

In the second video, the red team lines up as if they were going to kick a field goal. However, it's a very long attempt, so they shift formations as if they were going to punt the ball. So the other team responds by shifting back into a punt return formation (one guy goes back to try to catch the punt). Instead, they try a pass play by sneaking a player out on the opposite side of the field.

In football, players have very specific positions. The kicker is only good at kicking. The punter is only good at punting, etc. So it's not common for something like this to happen, because the field goal unit is not comprised of players who are actually good at throwing, running, or catching.

In that second video, it's actually the punter who is throwing the pass. The punter was on the field because he typically holds the ball for the kicker. So when they shifted formations, the punter became the one to take the snap from center. Nobody expects a punter to be able to throw the ball 60 yards.

And again, it was fourth down, so if the pass wouldn't have been caught, they would have given up the ball back where the play originally started.

Confusing the defense is fair play and important. It would have been slightly illegal under NFL rules, however.

That would have been a legal NFL play. The center can give the ball to any other player in any way he wants (as long as the snap is one fluid motion).

And "confusing the defense" is fair play, but trying to literally trick a bunch of middle schoolers by having the coach lie is dirty. It also puts the QB in a risky position, because if the defense knows what's going on, he's going to get hit hard by a lot of people.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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Wow! :-X:o8-) Now I know how football works! Thanks, Matt!

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

OICW
Member #4,069
November 2003
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Wow! :-X:o8-) Now I know how football works! Thanks, Matt!

I still didn't get how exactly it's played but certainly got somewhat brighter picture.

That would have been a legal NFL play. The center can give the ball to any other player in any way he wants (as long as the snap is one fluid motion).

I still don't get one thing. Isn't there a referee who signales with a whistle that the game continues (assuming that the time is being stopped during shifting formations or whatever is happening)? It's reminiscent of a bully in icehockey. On such occasion the other team knows that the game is a go and wouldn't let the player pass through.

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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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OICW said:

I still don't get one thing. Isn't there a referee who signales with a whistle that the game continues

Yes (sometimes), but it only means that the offensive team can snap the ball. Until the ball is snapped, the defense (and the offense) cannot cross over the line of scrimmage (where the ball sits).

So there's kind of like a pre-play period where the offense has (usually) 40 seconds to get ready and ultimately snap the ball. But the whistle would indicate the beginning of that 40 seconds, not at the time that the play "begins" and the game clock starts ticking.

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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Matthew:

According to the official NFL rules, the snap does not have to be between the legs. The snapper in the video snaps the ball in one continuous smooth motion, so it's a legal snap. Rule 7, Section 3, Article 3:

The snap (3-32) may be made by any offensive player who is on the line but must conform to the following provisions:
(a) The snap must start with ball on ground with its long axis horizontal and at right angles to line, and
(b) The impulse must be given by one quick and continuous motion of hand or hands of snapper. The ball must actually leave or be taken from his hands during this motion.
(c) The snapper may not:
(1) move his feet abruptly from the start of snap until the ball has left his hands;
(2) have quick plays after the neutral zone starts if the officials have not had a reasonable time to assume their normal stances.

Penalty: For illegally snapping ball: Loss of five yards from spot of snap for false start.

However, he doesn't snap it into the QB's stationary hands. Instead, the QB moves forward and moves his hands to take the ball out of the snapper's hands. This is technically a violation of Rule 7, Section 2, Article 6:

At the snap, all offensive players must be stationary in their positions:
(a) without any movement of feet, head, or arms;
(b) without swaying of body; and
(c) without moving directly forward except that one player only and he, playing in a backfield position, may be in motion provided he is moving, parallel to, obliquely backward from, or directly backward from the line of scrimmage at snap.

Note 1: No player is ever permitted to be moving obliquely or directly forward toward his opponent’s goal line at snap.
Note 2: Non-abrupt movement of head and/or shoulders by offensive players prior to the snap is legal. Players must come to a stop before ball is snapped. If officials judge the action of the offensive players to be abrupt, false start foul is to be called.

Penalty: For player illegally in motion at snap: Loss of five yards from previous spot. In case of doubt, this penalty shall be enforced.

In fact, A.R. 7.14 right after the above covers this situation specifically:

A.R. 7.14 Third-and-one on the B40. Quarterback A1 stops about a foot behind the center and then moves forward and takes the snap and goes to the B38.
Ruling: Illegal motion. Can’t be moving forward at snap. A’s ball third-and-six on B45.

However, I certainly think 7-2-6(a) is pretty loosely enforced these days for the QB, so there's a chance you might be able to get away with this. But, as it says, when in doubt, the penalty applies.

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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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First off, no NFL team would try that snap, so it doesn't matter.

However, those rules as written above (even if they are correct) are not enforced that strictly. Quarterbacks nearly always are moving forward at the time of the snap if they are in shotgun. Peyton Manning is the worst offender. It is never called. He literally takes a step forward before the snap. All quarterbacks move their hands. Even when under center, quarterbacks hands are moving.

Thus, I would argue it's still a legal snap, assuming the quarterback is reasonably "set" before taking the handoff with his feet primarily behind the line. Moving your upper body or leaning over definitely doesn't violate the rules.

In fact, that play is very clean looking. The only thing I would consider potentially illegally is that the motion doesn't seem to be continuous. The center cannot hold the ball out for the quarterback to take (like a handoff). But one could easily do that play with a more fluid motion (where the QB's hands are "stationary" and the center hands him the ball).

Edit:

Here's a video of Peyton. Just watch a few seconds into it:

video

He's moving forward at the time of the snap moreso than the QB in the original clip.

Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

It's horrible sportsmanship.

Yeah, but any sports need laughs every now and then. Don't take it too seriously.

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weapon_S
Member #7,859
October 2006
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Would you call it bad sportsmanship if you get angry, when losing to such a fake-out?
This certainly made me more appreciative of American football. Then I remembered the time spent doing nothing/switching/deliberating.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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weapon_S said:

Would you call it bad sportsmanship if you get angry, when losing to such a fake-out?

Getty angry is an emotion... People who get angry cannot generally control that. I personally never get angry. So I don't think it's a sign of bad sportsmanship.

If you have specific actions in mind, then perhaps. If you were to sucker punch the coach after the game, then that would be bad.

Quote:

Then I remembered the time spent doing nothing/switching/deliberating.

Televised events can be painfully slow since the networks have to get their allocated commercials in. But if you watch an untelevised game at the college or high school level, you'll find it much more fast paced. And if you actually understand what's going on, the pre-snap portion of the play doesn't seem like nothing.

But continuous doesn't imply excitement. To me, the entire game of soccer is a bunch of nothing. But with something like ice hockey and basketball, you do have non-stop action.

However, professional baseball is the absolute worst of the major team sports to watch. :-X

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