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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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Tilemap Engine Demo #2, released! See, I can program This is a more premature release than I hoped for though. Well, it's going to be a while before I finally finish a) my advanced collision detection system and b) multipart game objects, which will require a fair amount of planning before I try anything in code. Plus speed has become a minor issue, so I want everyone's feedback on the frames per second. You can bring up some game stats (including fps) and a very simple tilemap editor by pressing 2. Pressing 1 gets rid of it all. You can run around and through all the totally harmless (for now) enemies, throw punches and trips using RCtrl, and jump down through platforms by crouching and jumping (note the conveyor belts and the sliding blocks are solid; you can't pass through them). The sliding blocks will crush you when I get around to coding it. Also, can you tell I'm proud of my slopes? The game is chock full of programmer's art; I'm going to hand draw it all when the time comes (and no, the hero won't look like that). So ignore the ugliness. It will also feature parallax scrolling, including one foreground and two background tilemaps which scroll together, plus whatever in the background scrolling at different speeds. I also didn't bother implementing animated or transparent tiles, but I will eventually. Once I get that collision detection and multipart enemies implemented I'll design all the levels and enemies so I'll know exactly what I need. I also need to figure out how to deal with vector-based platforms that spin and tilt and such. That would be really cool, but my math sucks and it may prove too much trouble. I think the engine is pretty cool as it is so far, anyway, so I may do without them. All the scripts are plain text and editable, but I suggest you don't; the game is relying on them to be as they are. Also the game automatically saves your tilemap edits when it closes (right click copies, left click pastes) so be wary of that. I also need to give the animations their own file format. What I'm doing now is damn sloppy, I know. I'll fix it. Once everythng above is done and I've made some competent editors (and maybe a cool official web site), I'll probably release the first proper demo, with an actual finished level and more finalized graphics. Lemme know the fps and any bugs, and of course any comments. It generally runs at 50 - 60 on my computer, which looks good. It starts getting choppy around 40; hopefully it'll run at least that fast for everyone. I already have some ideas for speeding it up, like restricting enemies to a range instead of the current (kind of slow) way they check for edges on the fly. Post any suggestions or questions too. This will ultimately be a pretty big game, with at least a dozen or so big levels with unique graphics for each one, plus a cool storyline. I've been sitting on a character design for 7 years, and instead of making a little test game first (like with my shooter) figured I'd just make this game right off. Hope you like it -- |
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LoHoL
Member #1,752
December 2001
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i've got it run at 15 fps... i'll try later sans my internet conection (my computer isn't really modern:-/) you should put some restriction : as example, if i delete a tile at bottom of the level and then fall in i've to restart the prog to test again...but you've said it's not yet finished so i assume it's in your todo list (but probably in the finish game we won't be able to modify levels) That's seem good:) --- |
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Ultio
Member #1,336
April 2001
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FPS 200 or so Well, that's at least what my computer said. Anyways, time to talk about the enginey thingie: First of all, it moves really weird. I know it depends on lots of real physics in it. I notice that just how long it takes to speed up is exactly how long it takes to slow down. That's neat, but that might detract from gameplay in the future. The player might find themselves falling off ledges all the time due to the fact that it takes so long to slow down. Also, I see that the jumping is really smooth. That's good. The only downfall I see if when you jump into something that is blocked overhead. The jump instantly stops and sends you down. This doesn't seem to be very good. It's hard to jump around when you're confined to a small space. A game that I love to use for reference in jumping is metroid (super). When you jump and something blocks your way, you'll stay up in the air for the regular duration of the jump, and then fall down. That's just one thought. In my sidescroller I had jumping exactly the way you had it: if you hit something, just fall immediately. I took it out and now it feels much nicer (to me, anyways). I really like the attack sequence for the player. It's really cool how you have to wait for the attack to be done before attacking once again. Good job on that. I also like how you can crouch and attack. That's neato, too! The collision detection is a little funky when you run into a corner. Your head really overlaps all the other tiles. I'm specifically talking about the bottom leftmost corner of the map. Maybe it was supposed to be that way, I don't know - but I'm just letting you know. The moving platforms are kind of huge, and also they sometimes just fly right over other tiles, too. This just looks weird. In your maps maybe you should just leave them with open space to float around in. I do like how some platforms don't move until the player hops on top of it. That's really neato. I don't know if I missed anything. If you have any specific questions about something, feel free to ask. Other than that, it looks really good. The way I see it now, it looks like this seems to be some kind of game where you'll always be running around, and fast paced like that. This is just the impression I'm getting. --- |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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All of the "underside" angled tiles (solid tops and empty bottoms) share the same bitmask; the top layer of pixels are solid and the other 31 are empty. So yes, that collision detection in the lower left is perfectly normal. I can make it more accurate, but I see no reason right now. As far as running and jumping velocities, it's all in the testing phase now; they may change as time goes on. As for games where the characters always stop instantly, ever play Super Mario Bros. 3? You're point on jumping against the roof is noted. I know of it and am just planning on preventing it in the level layouts. I especially hate how it can kill x-velocity, depending on the angle. Metroid is the only game I know of that does what you say, though. Platforms hitting tiles is for testing; you'll notice platforms can pick you up, drop you off, and you don't move through walls when on platforms either. It's for purposes of engine testing, is all There'll be a few attacks; he can't attack in a jump yet. In my original test game the player could punch the goblin and it would recoil; you could trip the goblin and it fell over Fun fact: the upper-left conveyor belt moves in the opposite direction than the others. You can see this by the animation, or by just riding it. Note it also affects the speed of the goblins as they run back and forth. Oh yeah; on my to-do list is a particle engine. Like the player kicking up subtle dust clouds when he runs, or the sliding platforms dropping minute debris where they rub together. And fire. The enemies will have fire attacks, to be sure PS: Anyone notice the vanishing block (a la Mega Man)? I considered making an area full of them so you can try to reach to top .... Ultio: 200fps? ^_^ LoHoL: 15fps? >_< -- |
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Ultio
Member #1,336
April 2001
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I noticed the vanishing blocks, and to tell you the truth, they are HUGE! This, however, is not a problem. It is a very good thing. I think all of us know how annoying it is to try to hop vanishing blocks that are only as wide as the player's bounding box. That's a pain in the donkey. Keep them big. That big would be cool, but that's kind of huge. Maybe cut it in half. As long as they're big enough that you don't fall off 99% of the time. I noticed how the running animation gets faster as well. I implemented that in my sidescroller, too. I know how you feel. You always want people to comment on all the little things that are cool that you programmed in. The things are so suble that users can't really pick them out. Just think of it this way - if they're not complaining about it, then in their subconcious they are accepting it as something good. Think about if you didn't speed up the animation. Someone would instantly pick this off as being "wrong" because it just doesn't look right. However, if it looks right - that's just all, it's looking right. Most people probably wouldn't go: "Wow! It moves the way it should!" Good work! [Edit] Maybe this will help you in figuring out the HUGE fps difference --- |
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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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The only thing I didn't like was how long it took to slow down. It may be good for an ice level, but as it is now, it's a bit much... Running against the belts also doesn't seem to effect much speed. (Ie, most games go overkill - where when you run against a belt, it drastically slows you down, but running with it is a huge speedup.) The concept of slow down is good, but if it's excessive, it just gets annoying. What would be nice (and I don't know if I've ever played a game that does this) is to include a `stop' button, that lets the player stop on a dime if he really needs to. Run too fast and press it, the guy my fall over - in any case, you could include some sorta special animation when trying to stop while running fast. Overall, everything else looked really good & smooth. About 150-175 FPS depending on how much was on screen. |
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Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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So far, the engine seels fairly good, I agree with Matthew. On my sisters p2 350 it runs at a somewhat steady 60fps are there any other updating modes? like vram double buffering? or even page flipping? -- |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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I forgot to mention: Shift & v turns on vsync(), v alone turns it off. In case anyone cares. Quote: I think all of us know how annoying it is to try to hop vanishing blocks that are only as wide as the player's bounding box. That's a pain in the donkey. Keep them big. That big would be cool, but that's kind of huge. Maybe cut it in half. Cuttng it in half would make it the size of the player's bounding box Quote: Just think of it this way - if they're not complaining about it, then in their subconcious they are accepting it as something good. It's true, the best special effects are the ones you never notice Quote: Running against the belts also doesn't seem to effect much speed. Speed can be adjusted. I could give them all different speeds if I want ... I didn't think he drifted that far (Mario drifts at least that far) but you can duck while running. That slows him down pretty quick. Quote: are there any other updating modes? like vram double buffering? or even page flipping? Right now it's just double buffering since it's the fastest on my computer. I'll make a note; next time, allow the player to choose the screen update method at the beginning of the game. Doesn't the Allegro demo do that? Maybe I can just rip the code out of that. -- |
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Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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have you tried video memory double buffering? Ive found its (>10x) faster than page flipping and double buffering (on a Rage 128 Pro, and a TNT2), Its almost exactly like double buffering except the buffer is an off screen video page, just use blit (not show_video_bitmap...) -- |
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bozokadafi
Member #2,070
March 2002
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it ran well here. steady 57fps on my Velocity 4400. i thought it was hella neat! |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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TF: I'm aware of video memory double buffering, but I don't recall ever trying it. Anyway, I'll save it for next round -- |
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Paul Pridham
Member #250
April 2000
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Hey, it's looking real nice so far. The physics seems a little "contrived" to me, perhaps. When you are running, especially on the steep triangular floors, as you crest the peak I am expecting my guy to catch some air, but I seem to be glued to the ground. Is this what's happening? ---- |
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Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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oh... A Ghz is 1024 Mhz -- |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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Yeah, he's got gum shoes. Realistic physics aren't really a big issue for me; this isn't Gran Turismo (plus I don't expect a lot of peaks like that in the finished game anyway). So go ahead and bash on the physics, because they do suck, but they're good enough for me. TF: Golly, thanks. Now what's a Mhz? -- |
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DanielH
Member #934
January 2001
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Attack of the Chris Barry Clones! Very good, and I agree with Matthew about the slowdown. |
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Thomas Fjellstrom
Member #476
June 2000
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Chris> um... how fast is your computer? Mhz == Mega Hertz... Ghtz == Giga Hertz... I belive Hertz == cycles per second... Could be wrong though. [edit] I told you how much a Gtz is -- |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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Yeah, but I don't know how fast x many Ghz is or whatever. I don't even know how many this computer right here has (nor would I know how to check). Quote: Attack of the Chris Barry Clones! Those are open mouths with fangs, not goatees Quote: Very good, and I agree with Matthew about the slowdown. You guys have no taste. Can't you just tap in the opposite direction? Anyway, I just gave him a pair of new runners and recompiled. See if it's more to your liking (and if it's not, I'll give him cleats ....) -- |
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LoHoL
Member #1,752
December 2001
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i run at 22 fps without my conection configuration : --- |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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OUCH! I tried my game at work and got 1 - 2 fps -- |
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Mars
Member #971
February 2001
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Quote: A Ghz is 1024 Mhz I don't think so. Hz is a physical unit, not one from computer science. 1 Hz = 1/s 1 kHz = 1000 Hz (kilo) 1 MHz = 1000 kHz (mega) 1 GHz = 1000 MHz (giga) 1 THz = 1000 GHz (tera) I don't know what's after that, maybe Exa-Hertz????::) 1 GHz basically means that your chip calculates 1 billion cycles a second. Theoretically that's equivalent to 1 billion integer additions a second in your processor. If you really think about that, a normal mind should come to the conclusion that that's more speed than reasonable applications should ever need. Apparently normal minds don't think reasonably.:) -- |
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paranoima
Member #1,380
June 2001
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Wow, I think it looks very cool so far. I can't wait til I see a fully playable demo Just as it is now, it reminds me of a Commander Keen |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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paranoima: It's playable at that speed? Mars: Cool; thanks. So what's the standard these days? 1 Ghz? I'm also glad to hear there's no bugs -- |
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nonnus29
Member #2,606
August 2002
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I just tried the demo number two, noticed i'm a bit late on this one... 100fps Comments: The programmer art is pretty good actually, nice detail with the heaving chests and punches. I also thought the running physics was a bit hard to get used, mario moves a little after you stop, thats what I'm used too. |
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23yrold3yrold
Member #1,134
March 2001
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I toned the drifting down a bit last night, so hopefully it's better (that's the one that's up now). Cool stuff today; I got the goblins to react when they're punched! All they do is turn around (which is all they're supposed to do right now) but I know my collision code is working! Now I need them to react properly and maybe fight back PS: The punching and such isn't in the uploaded demo; you'll have to wait for that -- |
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Richard Phipps
Member #1,632
November 2001
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Hey Chris! Congratulations on actually doing some programming! I'm in shock!! Should I start spamming now? Seriously.. well done! |
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....
We're all used to games where the guy can stop almost instantly.
I look forward to implementing a lot of attacks and reactions. There'll be a lot of running and jumping, yes. Think old school Megaman or something. Very fast paced, lots of action.
). I'm not sure what good it does to tell me your hardware though, since I don't know what any of it means (besides RAM) 
After it's done I should try an 8-bit port ...
hehe..