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Why Allegro.cc Is Important AKA Social Media Is A Serious Thread To Humanity
bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Threat* Fuck. ::)

If you haven't yet I implore you to watch the film, "The Social Dilemma".

I've been saying for 13 years that social media was problematic. I just had no idea how bad it had gotten.

They're not just selling our data. They're selling our attention. And they're manipulating us subconsciously. And even the people that created these systems cannot resist them.

AI is controlling humanity TODAY. AI decides what posts appear in your customized social media feed. To the point where they may literally be isolating some of us with one version of "facts" and isolating others of us with a contradictory version of "facts". One of them is obviously a lie, but nevertheless the network pushes it on some of us because it's valuable to some stakeholder.

Could this potentially be behind the insanity in the USA right now? Just how serious is the problem? What the hell effect is this having on the children that grew up with this always around them. None of this is being regulated. Corporations are doing whatever maximizes profit without concern for what impact that has on people. And governments are standing by and watching. And all of us are oblivious that it's even going on.

Allegro.cc is important. The modern Web is not the same for all of us. What information we find is being manipulated. We cannot trust computers to give us facts. We must rely on each other to correct us when we're wrong. We used to do very well by that around 2006. We need to go back tot that. We know that social media is bad for us. Delete Facebook, Twitter, Snapchat. All of us. Come back here and communicate with real people without AI manipulating the conversation! :P

RmBeer2
Member #16,660
April 2017
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That is, to vociferate all the evils that we find? At least I remember that I kept writing all the garbage I found and how I tried to correct all that.

My purpose in creating my own server was to replace all that, including social media and the internet. I wanted to enable as a replacement the use of a social network, a forum, a file storage, an email, and various other services. What a poor fool i was.
In the end I gave up all of it.

You could say that the fault lies with AI or multinational companies, but the real fault lies with the people. They may even cry for salvation, but the truth is that they do not want it, they only pretend to seek a better quality of life when they only want the worst. :-/

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jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

I'm not sure it's a problem for us. I deleted my FB account in 2014, and even then it was seldom used. What I think is a threat to humanity is misinformation. When people don't understand that what they're looking at is inherently extremely biased. Those Got Talent shows are a great example, they're harmless sure but same idea. They don't show you the insane contracts contestants have to sign. They don't show you how the producers ask contestants to do certain things or have in certain ways. They don't show you the pre auditions for the producers. They try to fool the audience into believing a fairy tale. I have no problem with any of this when it's clear to the audience that this is all manufactured for entertainment. But people believe it is genuine and that's wrong. It's not like a rom com where you understand going into it that it is fiction.

Same for auto generated content. There should at the very least be a little disclaimer:

The following recommendations were generated by an AI and may reflect a biased view of events. Use critical judgement and ensure this is not your only source of information.

If they had something like that where I knew that people knew that the news feed was self serving, and made by an AI, then they could use their own judgement.

I have the same problem with music videos with loads of product placements and no disclaimer. Tons of kids watch that and don't understand the real reason they see BEATS headphones in 90% of shots. They just think, oh cool my favorite singer uses BEATS headphones, they must be good, I should get some.

That said, I think it should be illegal to show this kind of targeted autogenerated, biased content to minors under 18. I know COPPA is 13 but it should be 18. Even 18 is pushing it because the brain is still very influenceable and trying to adapt to what it believes is reality ground truth.

Once AI like GPT 3 becomes the norm and we start seeing ARTICLES specifically written FOR THAT USER, and it is indistinguishable from a real article, we're in real trouble.

>:(

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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It's a problem today. Now. Look at the USA. People are insisting that Trump is still a good leader. Are they mentally retarded? Or is their version of "the Internet" telling them lies?

The reality is that psychologists are involved in designing the feed to convince experienced, adult human beings to consume content repeatedly. And as it turns out the most profitable way for Facebook/Google/etc. to operate is to feed people misinformation. Misinformation gets people motivated to consume and participate. It keeps them glued to the social media. The misinformation or "fake news" is not accidental. It's very much by design.

And it fools even the people working at Facebook or Google that created it. You and I are not as immune as we like to think. We're better off than the average person, but that's irrelevant. When the misinformation is political in nature it affects us anyway. It can have real world consequences. It can effect how people view political candidates, and who they vote for. And they're oblivious to it.

You and I might take the time to Google ideas ourselves to fact check them most of the time, but we already know that 99% of people don't bother to do that ever, let alone most of the time. They just believe it. And run with it. And it affects their behavior. And they aren't aware of it. I'd be lying if I said I never fall prey to misinformation online. It's rare, but there are still instances where something plausible is put in front of me by AI that knows I'm biased towards it and I bite.

We have been regulating television and radio for decades. We don't regulate Internet services. We should. It's not about censorship. It's about preventing abuses of human psychology. Our brains are essentially millions of years old. The hardware has limitations. We're up against supercomputers running AI that even its creators don't fully understand. There's no way we can win.

We need to shut this business model down with regulations, and harsh penalties. Like bankrupt Facebook scale penalties. Like life imprisonment for Facebook shareholders penalties. They know that what they are doing is wrong. They have for a decade or more. Employees of these companies have even tried to raise the issue internally. And the corporation shut down that conversation. They do it knowing that they're exploiting vulnerabilities in human psychology. Knowing that human beings are susceptible to the tricks.

I insist that you take this seriously. It is a serious problem. It is affecting us now. It can lead to the downfall of our entire species. There is essentially AI that was designed with one purpose, maximizing profits, that has been trained to manipulate people and it is currently on the loose manipulating billions of people every day. The corporations that control it are making billions of dollars, all the while we as a people and society are failing to address very serious threats to our existence such as climate change and Donald Trump as president because these networks are pushing fake news down people's throats, and people don't even realize it. It's not that people are idiots or ignorant. It's that these systems are designed to BYPASS human intelligence and instead feed the primitive mechanisms in our brains from millions of years ago that were up against wolves and snakes, not supercomputer AI.

This is not a drill. Until we force them to change, these corporations will continue getting rich while human civilization goes to shit.

The Russians don't need to "hack" anything. They just need to purchase advertising space from Facebook, and Facebook's AI will shove the misinformation down American's throats. And Americans will do the right thing, or what they perceive to be the right thing, and ultimately will be actually doing Putin's bidding. And none of them realize they've been duped. None of them realize they've essentially been brainwashed.

Polybios
Member #12,293
October 2010

So, bambam, you want us to believe you're a real person? I thought you were Matthew's AI for inciting discussion to keep the site alive. :P

Anyway, of course you have a point here.

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
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I just use social media to keep up with friends. :-/ Am I using it wrong?

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Are you really keeping up with friends, or is the AI generating events on behalf of your friends for you to respond to to keep you engaged with the platform?

Unless your friends just post personal anecdotes without linking to anything on the Internet ever. ::) Even then the social media platforms will be affecting how your FRIENDS behave. So can you ever be sure of what your friends do on social media?

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

bamccaig said:

It's a problem today. Now. Look at the USA. People are insisting that Trump is still a good leader. Are they mentally retarded? Or is their version of "the Internet" telling them lies?

No doubt that media influences voters. Ironically if today, you literally never heard of Trump again... like I mean, he was still president, he did his thing, you got reports and facts on bills signed, etc... eg : you just got the output of the government black box, but Trump never tweeted, never got any coverage, or any mentions anywhere.... but his actions as president did not change, I'm sure he would lose hands down.

Loved watching this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8Y-P0v2Hh0

Quote:

I just use social media to keep up with friends. :-/ Am I using it wrong?

No, but they all collect your data, and we're okay with that. I remember back in the 90s when MSN Messenger literally was just there to establish an ip to ip peer to peer connection. So, while what you sent was in plain text, no one was actively storing it and analyzing it.

It depends how you use it too, is it just DMs, thats not too bad, but if you depend on news feeds then there is bias.

A big problem is the technology is so far ahead of the understanding of law makers and even citizens that we just will not see any laws around this stuff any time soon, even if it is deceptive and highly unethical.

To talk with my close friends, I give them access to my VPN, each with their own key, and we use an open source LAN messenger to talk and ensure that there is no paper trail... not because I have anything to hide, I just don't want to share my personal conversations with another entity... and that's my right not to want to.

Steve Terry
Member #1,989
March 2002
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tldr; A.cc forever!!!!!1 ;D

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DanielH
Member #934
January 2001
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Steve Terr said:

tldr; A.cc forever!!!!!1 ;D

Thanks for the laugh!

Yes, A.cc forever. Maybe an update or two would be nice though.

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
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IDK how posting selfies on Insta or liking pictures of dogs my friends post can influence me to vote for Trump.

...

I'm partially being an ass, like I'm sure many of my friends don't use Facebook/Insta/Tumblr the way I do. But you can use it the way I do and then your life is ok. :) I have too many friends, most of whom are not tech savvy, to depend on LAN VPNs or weird IMing platforms or even texts. 5ish close friends? Sure. The rest? Not feasible.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

Thats kind of the point. Most people kind of dont have a choice...

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Everybody has a choice. Few are strong enough to be the first to sacrifice.

Tools already exist to actually communicate with friends, family, etc. Better tools than social media actually! They just aren't "fashionable" anymore.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

Yes, of course everyone has a choice, that choice is often, assimilate your friends, abandon them, or accommodate them. Many choose the latter because most people will not change for you, even if it's in their interest to do so.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
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jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

About.... 22 years ago....

RmBeer2
Member #16,660
April 2017
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First option: Don't use social networks.
Second option: Return to the first option.

It's hard? :-/

I can't find the vice. Everything scares you.

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Rm Beer for Emperor 2020!

Mark Oates
Member #1,146
March 2001
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Yea, I generally agree.

I stopped social a long time ago. I only listen to long-form conversations and lectures, watch light-hearted videos or researched documentaries, or watch disc golf coverage. I keep my phone in the other room when I sleep. I don't look at my phone in the morning until I start work for the day, and I wake by the sunrise. I only ever message and have conversations with people directly, never in public groups. (Acc would be the only exception).

I think humans are eating themselves. As far back as I have cared to consider, it all probably started around the introduction of language. "Ideas" have hacked the human species and they are the gods we serve.

Bodies don't naturally become overweight. Our teeth don't naturally become crooked and rot. Porn has turned our natural sex drives into an evolutionary trap. Sustained anxiety for no reason is not a natural psychological state. These, to name a few, are symptoms of the human species in an unnatural environment. Social media and the introduction of incredibly rapid, disparate, and fragmented pieces of information have hijacked our minds and retarded the intentionality of our agency. Simply put, human brains are overloaded with information.

bamccaig said:

It's that these systems are designed to BYPASS human intelligence and instead feed the primitive mechanisms in our brains from millions of years ago that were up against wolves and snakes, not supercomputer AI.

It's like we created the ultimate troll. ;D

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
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RmBeer2
Member #16,660
April 2017
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Those who don't want to use social networks are useless for large corporations. Google, twitter, facebook, discord, telegram, instagram, and other networks are going to unify their forces to exterminate all the useless in the society. When that day comes, it's time to be a fugitive. Who will be the leader of the resistance?

๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ ๐ŸŒŸ Web of BlackRook ๐ŸŒŸ YouTube ๐ŸŒŸ ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ

Rm Beer for Emperor 2020!

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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I like entering random terms into Facebook's (and Google's) search bar just to screw with their algorithms.

RmBeer2
Member #16,660
April 2017
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LennyLen said:

I like entering random terms into Facebook's (and Google's) search bar just to screw with their algorithms.

Or the algorithm will believe that you like any crap. :S

๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ ๐ŸŒŸ Web of BlackRook ๐ŸŒŸ YouTube ๐ŸŒŸ ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ๐ŸŒˆ

Rm Beer for Emperor 2020!

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

LennyLen said:

I like entering random terms into Facebook's (and Google's) search bar just to screw with their algorithms.

So you're engaging with the platform. Perfect.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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I think that it's a bit misleading to say "algorithm" anyway. We're talking about AI and ML. The computers have programmed themselves. It might not even be possible to determine what entering "random" terms might do. But odds are it would have an insignificant effect unless that's predominantly all you do. We're talking about computer programs that can reshape themselves that are analyzing data from BILLIONS of people. Theoretically these programs understand humanity better than we do.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

The software is trying to optimize for keeping you engaged and on the platform for as long as it can. As the documentary said, they're competing for your attention.

So, sure, enter a bunch of random search terms, it looks for patterns, and probably ignores anything else. If you spend 15 minutes entering random things in the search, that's 15 minutes of opportunities for them to either show you ads or to find content that you cannot resist clicking on to keep you on the site for even longer. So you came to troll, but you stayed to read the article about how research shows that people who enter random keywords to troll search engines are statistically up to 50% more intelligent.

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