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bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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NiteHackr said:

My apologies for my angry response, though I still feel that if you think that "jabbing me with a needle" to force your vaccines onto me or anyone is a good idea, than you need to seriously reevaluate your morals. And if nobody else in here sees his comment about doing that as wrong, well, that's all the more reason to avoid these forums.

It's not just "jabbing you with a needle" to "force" ideas on you. It's forcing you to receive protection from harmful diseases that will help to protect you and others (obviously, anybody can be a carrier of disease, but somebody that actually becomes infected with the disease will carry it longer and further than somebody that just happens to get the virus on/in them without allowing it to grow off of them).

Doctors, who despite their flaws and faults still know more about this than anyone, universally supported everyone getting flu shots and vaccinations. Ultimately, we must trust science because that science is knowledge, and knowledge is the best we can do. Science is not perfect, however, it can be proven to be effective which is more than anyone can say of their faith.

The reason I can dismiss your faith as a contributor to your so-called healing is because I know for a fact that it's not a reliable way to get help. If it was we could test it and prove that it works. We cannot. What happens is that people pray to God for things, and if they get them they credit God, and if they don't get them then they excuse it as not God's will. It doesn't work that way. Either it's God's doing or it's not. Either it works or it doesn't. If you have no way of knowing whether or not praying will help then there's no reason to pray at all. Sometimes, more often than I sometimes deserve, things work out very well for me (and other times, they don't). I'm an athiest. I don't believe that any God exists at all. I regularly curse and mock the idea, especially the Christian God because it's what I was raised to believe in and the most likely God for my peers to believe in. It certainly wouldn't make much sense for any Christian God to help me out.

Praying to God has never been demonstrated under reasonable conditions (i.e., no magician pulling strings behind a curtain) to be any more effective for getting what you want than just hoping for it or doing nothing at all. Sometimes you get what you want and sometimes you don't. It has a whole lot to do with privilege and luck. Being born to lower-middle class families in Canada instead of being born to impoverished families in South Sudan, Iraq, or North Korea has a whole lot more to do with our relatively good fortunes than either of our beliefs.

We can't even be sure that you ever had diabetes, let alone that it's cured. And it's not even scientifically impossible for that to have happened on its own. Seemingly serious, incurable diseases seemingly disappear on a regular basis around the world. It's rare, but it does happen, and so far scientists cannot explain them (once we explain them with science they fall out of that category). We don't know everything yet, and we never will. If you want to take your chances, ignore doctors and science, and just truth in your faith that's your business. I don't generally have a problem with that.

As far as I'm aware there is no risk to anyone else from you refusing pharmaceuticals for a diabetes diagnosis, nor of you refusing a tetanus shot or flu shot. I've lived without either for about 20 years myself. I just got an updated tetanus shot about a month ago, now that I finally have a GP of my own, and a wife that cares enough for me to care about myself. Prior to that my last shot was probably as a preadolescent.

However, your liberties end where the next man's begin. Your freedom to be ignorant does not afford you the freedom to risk other people's lives. If coronavirus continues to spread and continues to be deadly it may well come to a point where forced vaccines are necessary for the very survival of the human species. And in such a case I would fully support you being vaccinated at gunpoint, or killing you if you refused.

I don't think that's likely to happen, however. Hopefully we'll manage to contain it and/or treat enough of the population so that it no longer presents a serious threat, and those that refuse vaccinations will be the only ones vulnerable. Maybe our immune systems will even begin to adapt and form their reliable defences.

I think it was always pretty obvious that Edgar was never actually threatening to personally poke you with a needle (don't worry, Neil, I just had one and they don't hurt nearly as bad as I remember as a child!). He isn't even from the same nation so even if his government decided to force vaccinations on its people, which is probably among the least likely nations to do so, it wouldn't extend to you. Relax, and don't take things so seriously.

All that said, I choose to put my faith in the scientific community, and that extends to doctors and other health professionals. They say that everybody should be vaccinated, and that the risks are negligible. For that purpose I would support forced vaccinations if only to improve everyone's quality of life.

As a conservative, you might also appreciate that if everyone was vaccinated say against the flu every year that might boost the economy by boosting productivity and reducing sick days used. Regardless of political leaning I think that we can all agree that that is a desirable outcome (except for maybe a few of us that benefit from the extra break from workplace environments). Your fear of vaccinations is out of ignorance, not education nor experience. You have been vaccinated before and you're just fine, as you keep emphasizing. Most of us are doing reasonably well, and we've all been vaccinated before with something.

There are individual quack doctors or scientists (you often quote them to support your ideas), but overall the scientific and medical communities are very reliable for doing what's best for us. They would not be recommending people get a flu shot if there was more risk doing so than not for the average person, or they'd be more specific in their recommendations to target only those most vulnerable. Instead, the vast majority agree that everyone should be vaccinated. The risks are negligible.

And finally I am 100% against the pharmaceutical industry that has proven time and again that it puts profits above patient health. It is enraging and sickening that governments from both extremes permit and even empower this. There really are medicines that do more harm than good, and sometimes misinformed or misguided doctors push those on people en mass. The solution there isn't to stop trusting doctors, but rather to stop trusting our corrupt bought-and-paid-for governments. Science only works as well as it is allowed to work. That means we need to fund all of the science, not just the science that is highly profitable. Pharmaceuticals are highly profitable. Cannabis, which anyone can grow, is only highly profitable during prohibition. And that explains why it has been prohibited for so long. But we've managed to undo that, and if we keep working together we can disenfranchise the elite and empower the every-man instead.

For example, government can ban for-profit pharmaceuticals. I personally believe it is unethical to make a profit from medicine, let alone life-saving medicine. Proprietary medicine should not be a thing. Instead, medicine should be forced open and free, and sold at cost to produce and deliver it (and even then, subsidized by taxpayers when that remains out of reach). Once the money disappears from the equation you'll find that a whole lot less harmful drugs are available or prescribed, and only medicines that actually do good will be prescribed. That won't happen until we force it to happen though.

NiteHackr said:

I'm done "debating" in here, it's pointless. I'll do it my way which has actually worked. You trust your vaccines etc and see where that gets you. My mother trusted the doctors and this world and she died at 49. My oldest brother trusted the doctors, their pills and vaccines and he also died a few years ago. My father refused meds which made his legs weak (statins, very bad for you) and he just turned 79.

Correlation does not imply causation. The two events are unrelated. Life is extremely complicated. Far more complicated than we often have time to give it credit for. As a rule, most of it is out of our control, and we're just along for the ride. Unfortunately, bad things happen sometimes, even to good people, even to people that do everything "right". And contrarily sometimes great things happen to people that do everything "wrong". There isn't always a relationship between events. Sometimes A leads to B, and sometimes B occurs in spite of no A. The complexity of life is awe-inspiring (and no, I do not require any deity or supreme-being to explain how it can be so).

Your own faith in God pretty much rules out any correlation at all. For all you know, God is pulling the strings entirely, and deciding who lives and dies. Perhaps nothing any of us do matters. Surely if your God can protect you from the flu he can also protect you from the flu shot. ;) What are you afraid of?

NiteHackr
Member #2,229
April 2002

Truly this Bible verse is proven true in here...

Proverbs 9:7 (NIV)
Whoever corrects a mocker invites insults; whoever rebukes the wicked incurs abuse.

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

bamccaig said:

Border control doesn't mean much unless you're going to shut down your border and restrict Americans from coming back too.

Well obviously that's the point. The countries that have been paying attention have quarantined their returning citizens. The problem is that the incubation period for the virus was underestimated and in some cases quarantine procedures were willfully violated. And no, it's not racist to target our most porous border, but that's just the type of lame propaganda I've come to expect that from some people in this thread. Administering a vaccine against somebody's will is a form of violence, but I suppose to a globalist, personal autonomy is not important in this instance but it is in others (ie. abortion "rights").

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
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jmasterx said:

Is Aaron Bolyard the only one even making games around here anymore?

I'm pretty sure I'm the only active older-timer member who is making a game.

I only stick around so when I sell enough copies to afford a Tesla Roadster I can rub it in everyone's faces. 8-)

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

I only stick around so when I sell enough copies to afford a Tesla Roadster I can rub it in everyone's faces.

I've always really admired your vector graphic stuff, I think it's sooo cool! I hope you do sell a lot of copies!

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
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Thank you! I'm planning launching on Steam via Early Access by the end of the year. I should be 1/3rd of the way done by then, and have 20-40 hours of content. Currently there's 5 hours of content.

I'm hoping for about ~10K copies sold, which means I could afford a down payment on a house sooner than later in Charlotte, NC.

I'd need to sell ~150K copies to afford a Tesla Roadster. (Keyword being afford, ~35K copies means I could buy one).

These numbers reflect post-taxes, post-Steam's cut. If I manage to get a publisher, I'd need higher numbers because the publisher will take a cut as well. And this is assuming a price point somewhere between $14.99 and $19.99. It's all very fuzzy.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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Likewise, best of luck game!

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Valve/Steam is a publisher, and one of the best, and I think they're pretty open to hosting any game with market potential, so I don't think you'd need to get a separate publisher. And I 100% believe that the game you're making would pass Steam approval, and probably do relatively well. That is, with the 30-40 hours of content you're aiming for; though I think they've even supported 5 hour games in the past.

Of course, you could instead try the pay-what-you-want model and hope for true success. It encourages a little income from people that couldn't or wouldn't at "retail" price, while also empowering the generous to give extra. I could see a game like yours doing well in Humble Bundle (though honestly I haven't been keeping up with that since they sold out so perhaps that's not a thing anymore?).

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
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Valve won't advertise your game, (e.g.) Adult Swim Games will. 🙃

I've heard a lot of good games die in the depths of Steam's humongous catalog. I don't know how true that is, but I don't want mine to be one of those!

I gotta change my name then form an LLC too. Ugh wait a pain.

...

Also Donald Trump PERSONALLY ruined my plans tonight. Traffic is gonna so bad on I-77 because he's giving a rally in Charlotte, NC at the Bojangles Coliseum (of course!). UNFORGIVABLE.

If I go to north Charlotte (i.e., University City), I have to take I-77.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
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You've put a lot of good work into this game Aaron. You should be proud of all you've done so far.

@bambams
Blasphemy is no joke. Consider God real, even if you find no proof of him. Better you stay on his good side. ;)

Polybios
Member #12,293
October 2010

Oh wow you "believers" are reaching new lows any time you turn away from the shithole this nice forum has become for a while. Now you threaten violence to each other... :-/ Have you passed kindergarden?

Blasphemy is no joke. Consider God real, even if you find no proof of him. Better you stay on his good side.

Can't you just stop threatening people with your crap for a while? Is this compulsive? Just shut the fuck up and focus on the big planks obviously protruding from your frontal cortices. >:(

Best of luck to you and your game, Aaron. :)

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

It wasn't a threat. It was friendly advice.

There's no plank in my eye, but thank you for your consideration of my well being.

NiteHackr has a rage problem. He should see a doctor. Or a priest.

And God doesn't offend me, you're the one with the problem.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

Blasphemy is no joke. Consider God real, even if you find no proof of him. Better you stay on his good side. ;)

I'm not trying to stir shit up but by that logic couldn't I say:

Consider Santa real, even if you find no proof of him. Better you stay on his good side. ;)

You could literally say that about any entity that cannot be proved tangibly.

Faith and spirituality are very personal and individual experiences. Nothing is real anyways, our whole reality is filtered through our brain. I do believe that some people have had genuine life changing religious experiences. I do believe for some people, religion can be helpful for a variety of things. Hope, guidance, role model, and many other practical applications. I don't think people should literally fear God, or behave a certain way 'just in case' there is someone watching you and keeping track of your goodness.

I think it should better your life, and help you be the best person you can be. If it doesn't do that then it's not right for you.

I don't think religion should be pushed on people too. In the same way, a medication prescribed for John could have terrible consequences for Mary. If it's God's plan for you to follow Him and have Him guide you, then he will make sure you find Him.

There was a YouTuber named Christina Grimmie, her, her family, and best friends; all deep devoted, caring loving good, wholesome Christians.

Christina Grimmie was a hard working YouTuber working on her career as a singer, she was on The Voice in 2014. She was murdered in Orlando in June 2016 by a guy who was infatuated with her. Then about a year later her mother passed away after a battle with breast cancer. Christina's best friend Sarah has made a lot of interesting pod casts going into detail how it was a difficult struggle and how she questioned why God would have such a plan. It's quite interesting.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

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Thank you Trump <3

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

The virus scare was to blame for the abrupt drop, but persisting confidence in the markets was why it began correcting itself abruptly.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

I'll just leave this here
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raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

Single day jumps aren't very meaningful. I'm sure you understand that.

jmasterx
Member #11,410
October 2009

Of course I do - I'm just being funny ;D

NiteHackr
Member #2,229
April 2002

A really fascinating video with some mind blowing facts about vaccines. Lengthy, but worth the watch.

video

Polybios said:

Oh wow you "believers" are reaching new lows any time you turn away from the shithole this nice forum has become for a while. Now you threaten violence to each other... :-/ Have you passed kindergarden?

You're absolutely right. my apologies, I did not set a good example. I just don't respond well to threats, but, I suppose I shouldn't respond to certain things at all. I'm still working on that aspect of myself, it's an uphill battle these days, but I am getting there. ;)

This is not how I am normally like, and it is why I don't come to these forums a lot anymore as it can get toxic in here.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

NiteHackr
Member #2,229
April 2002

And now, something less toxic. I just about died laughing when I first seen this. ;)

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bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

Licensed cannabis store just opened in my city. :D Tonight was the "grand opening". Of course, I went. Dropped $180 on vape pens and CBD oil. >:( I'm surprised how well stocked they were, though they seem to be running out fast. It's nice to have it a short drive away now. No need to wait 3-5 days anymore. :D

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

I find it hilarious how the media is bashing Bernie the same way it did Trump (while liberals were completely okay with it) and now a sudden... it's a bad thing!

This week, the New York Times (not Fox News!) put out a "Bernie Sanders is an agent of the Soviet Union [not Russia. SOVIET. UNION]". It wasn't even in the opinion section.

The last eight years have never made it more clear that the MSM are just a wing of the DNC establishment. And if they want you peasants to vote for someone that is pro-war, they're gonna tell you.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
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