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Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

Friend, I have posited a solution: socialism, where workers (*not the state*) own the means of production.

Workers of the world unite. 8-)

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ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Aaron, don't you know 'Socialism' is a giant buzzkill? As we know, most people associate Socialism with Communist Russia's failed attempt. They see it as a bogey man. You just can't mention that word around them. It's their trigger word. Like Mine is Republican, or Trump, or McConnell, or Barr. RRRRrrrrrgle#@!

Bernie's 'Socialism' is simply doing what's right, taking care of people, whether they "deserve" it or not. It's not about handouts, it's about rights. Rights to basic things like food, shelter, health care, education, infrastructure, jobs, etc....

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
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Socialism is a great system for insects or robots, but it doesn't mix well with humanity.

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

Here comes the part where I accused them of being historically ignorant of Socialism. Maybe they should look up the track record of Socialist (typo) regimes and their tendency towards horrific tyranny and murder, even today.

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

> Socialism is a great system for insects or robots, but it doesn't mix well with humanity.

Here we go, human nature fallacy! Have you ever even taken like a sociology 101 class or been exposed to non-Western cultures?

> Here comes the part where I accused them of being historically ignorant of Socialism. Maybe they should look up the track record of Socialist (typo) regimes and their tendency towards horrific tyranny and murder, even today.

Ah yes, just like the Democrat People's Republic of Korea is Democratic because it's in the name! Wait, that's not right.

Why can you never show me a country that used Karl Marx's definition of socialism that was soOoOoO bad, not your worthless definition of socialism? Oh that's right, because there hasn't been one.

When a country where the workers own the means of production goes to hell, then maybe I'll concede my point. Unless like it was because the great ol' USA interfered with cute things like assassinations and coupes like they always do when a socialist gets elected somewhere.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Socialism, you give democracy a bad name.

Stop asking people to support Socialism. You'll never un-taint that name.

As you said, there has never been a true socialist state. And there probably never will be, because it's a class war Aaron. This is not politics, this is class war. Know your enemy.

We are the caste and the workers, and the means to an end for the people who use us, the oligarchs.

LennyLen
Member #5,313
December 2004
avatar

Here we go, human nature fallacy! Have you ever even taken like a sociology 101 class or been exposed to non-Western cultures?

No, and yes.

Show me a single working human example of socialism (that involves more than a handful of people) and I'll take back my comment. Until then, it stands.

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

I'd rather do positive things with my time than make the same arguments that fall on deaf ears over and over again.

Take that as you will.

edit: To clarify, I'm actually doing things (i.e., volunteering) to help improve my community, and hopefully in the future more than that; arguing on the internet is a waste of my time when I could volunteer with the DSA or a local LGBT youth center (the largest between New York, NY and Atlanta, GA for the record) or whatever else.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

Show me one example of capitalism working well. Capitalism works great for the rich. Capitalism works great for evil. Capitalism is a terrible system for good. Capitalism ensures there will always be people suffering. Capitalism does not take care of the poor. Capitalism penalizes them. It holds weak people down. Fucking disgraceful. Meanwhile it holds rich people up. Are you the son of a billionaire? You get to fuck hookers and snort cocaine at 12 years old because why would you ever have to do anything? Meanwhile, on the other end of the spectrum a poor man has to work 3 or 4 jobs just to keep the lights on and food on the table. Seems fair.

The only people with any power in a capitalist society are wealthy people. Everybody else: shut your fucking mouth. Your opinion doesn't matter. You don't have a say. Your motherfucking vote doesn't even count. Your vote doesn't count. It never has. It has been setup this way by design from the beginning. If that doesn't make you fucking angry then you're a fucking idiot.

The whole point of Capitalism is supposed to be that the system is self-healing. Prices are kept fair through competition. Funny thing is competition is only permitted when it's mega corporations versus mom-and-pop business owners. The corporations kill off the mom-and-pop stores that actually had any attachment to your town, and then the corporations turn on you once they have the monopoly. And then you see a mega corporation failing and instead of letting it die because it is failing government gives them huge subsidies of tax payer money.

There seems to be a pattern here.

Of course we haven't seen any working example of a better system before. If we had we'd already be in agreement that we should change to it. What a stupid argument. The idea that we're seeking hasn't been realized before. We're looking beyond what our wealthy overlords have taught us are the limits. We're trying to imagine a system where everybody is happy, healthy, and productive.

If you can think of a way to make the idea better then by all means we're listening. Defending the existing system is reprehensible. And you should be ashamed. If you think this is working then you must be living in a privilege bubble.

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
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bamccaig said:

Show me one example of capitalism working well.

*sent from my phone made by a private company, to my private cellphone company, over the backhaul internet owned by a private company to a website hosted by a private company, and back to my phone to the screen made by a private company

99% of everyone on planet earth is opposed to evil corporations doing evil things. But throwing out private ownership is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

> *sent from my phone made by a private company, to my private cellphone company, over the backhaul internet owned by a private company to a website hosted by a private company, and back to my phone to the screen made by a private company

The fuck you mean?

The US military and universities are responsible for the bulk of technology that made cell phones possible.

The republican bastardization of socialism exists, it's just for the rich (i.e, the capital owners {i.e., the bourgeoisie}])

Furthermore, you can be critical of something you use.

This is you:

{"name":"612333","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/9\/09b45c40600bd7a891a3c3a2135b0e8e.png","w":935,"h":691,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/9\/09b45c40600bd7a891a3c3a2135b0e8e"}612333

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

Quote:

The you mean?

Everyone else reading can decipher the meaning. :P

You think simply inventing technology is the only task for implementing it? And who laid all those internet backbone pipes? Universities? Who installed your cable modem? Teachers? And tons of academics get sponsored directly by companies to research. Further, look at the Linux kernel. Like 90% of all contributions are by paid professionals subsidized by interested private companies. ::)

The examples are unlimited as long as you don't shut your eyes and mutter "nyah nyah nyah"

I mean, come on. Your understanding of the world cannot be this juvenile.

I mean let's do it. Let's eliminate all private ownership--including bodies. After all if you can force someone to work, you can force them to have sex. So let's force women everywhere to bang any unattractive man because they have the ability, and men have the needs. So all women should become prostitutes. It's so much more civilized than capitalism. ;D Don't be such a right-wing snob about it.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

NiteHackr
Member #2,229
April 2002

This is a MUST WATCH for everyone. Even if you're not a fan of the show, you cannot deny the quotes from Democrats in it. Why would they suddenly be saying the opposite when Trump became president? ???

video

As for socialism...

Communist USSR = Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics. Socialism IS communism.

The NAZI party of Germany was called the "National Socialist Party".

The reason why people are fleeing Venezuela is because of socialism being imposed after the democratically elected president was ousted. Democracy and socialism are opposed to each other.

When you punish those who work hard to earn more and get ahead by taking their money and giving it to those who do not work hard. Than you remove all incentive for people to work hard and get ahead. You reward laziness and punish hard work.

This is why USSR collapsed. Sooner or later you run out of other people's money to spend. USSR was deep in debt and could no longer finance that system. It has ALWAYS failed in history. The whole reason why nations like the USA have been so prosperous is because it rewards hard work, though that is rapidly changing. Thanks to Trump we have seen a break from that, but I doubt that will last long as, sadly, Trump can only run in office for so long.

Oh, and before someone replies to this with a lot of cursing, swearing and other vulgar language, I simply won't read such replies if you can't remain civilized.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Nitehackr, you make me sigh deeply.

None of those were examples of Marx's Socialism. Educate yourself.

The USA has had high top tier tax rates before, and the sky didn't fall. Educate yourself.

It's called being responsible. When companies like Amazon pay 0 fucking dollars in taxes, that's thievery. They're putting the tax burden on everyone else. They're not paying their fair share. You're paying their share. Corporate taxes benefit everyone.

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

While scarcity exists, socialism will never work on a large scale. Feel free to implement it in the local communities who want it.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Are you kidding me? COUGH Europe COUGH

They've had socialized medicine and education for a while now.

Why is the backwards ass ASU always the last to adopt what's right for everybody?

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

NiteHacker, is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea democratic or republic?

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

99% of everyone on planet earth is opposed to evil corporations doing evil things.

People are thinking about themselves. America is the epitome of this. Corporations rarely shit directly on you. Typically you'll get your shit indirectly. People are not intelligent enough to comprehend that they're getting fucked. We of all communities should know trying to explain pointers to newbies for 2 decades. ::) Instead, people go all in with corporations, signing with the devil, without even reading the terms of the contract. Everybody is vaguely familiar with how evil Facebook has been. It has been reported on mainstream news several times. The vast majority of people are active users of Facebook. Nobody gives a fuck. They cannot comprehend how it relates to them. That's how corporations get away with it. People are stupid. I think more of you than to think that you cannot wrap your head around this. You of all people know how fucked the American system is.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

Don't whine at me, it's your political party.

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

{"name":"612340","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/9\/3\/930a221663dff5f1565be2863a7281bb.png","w":1282,"h":752,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/9\/3\/930a221663dff5f1565be2863a7281bb"}612340

8-) Other (X) is the best gender.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

NiteHackr
Member #2,229
April 2002

{"name":"612341","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/4\/04b354f62fbb3b3a3a49c22bd90c3109.jpg","w":580,"h":577,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/0\/4\/04b354f62fbb3b3a3a49c22bd90c3109"}612341

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

:'(;D

It seems to be a common occurrence for the Democrats to send the wrong person to the thumb war. I think there might be something to that. Keep on it!

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

I like turtles

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Aaron Bolyard
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

Got this email this morning. Google's Cloud Vision API won't be returning gendered labels anymore.

{"name":"612342","src":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/5\/c\/5ccc5882196afdaf582d9bb67a28235d.png","w":633,"h":591,"tn":"\/\/djungxnpq2nug.cloudfront.net\/image\/cache\/5\/c\/5ccc5882196afdaf582d9bb67a28235d"}612342

At least AI won't misgender peeps when it takes over. 8-) We're all just fleshy meat cattle to our AI overlords.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / them / their - Erin Maus

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