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Why not just turn off the ignition first...
verthex
Member #11,340
September 2009
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I read this article and could not believe that their last option to stop the car was turning it off. How many dumb cops are there in this world?

m c
Member #5,337
December 2004
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Much worse than that is that the diver picked up his cellphone instead of turning off the ignition and applying the breaks.

I don't think I even know any women that would be that... lame.

[EDIT] Me personally though, unless the engine was red-lining I'd just use the clutch to keep going along if I were on the highway (so long as there wasn't any traffic). But then I am someone who tends to use the clutch quite a lot, and clutch-pads failing due to heat isn't as dangerous as break pads failing, not that I abuse them..

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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Another person who shouldn't be driving. You should at least understand some basics about a vehicle and be able to stop it in an emergency, or else you have no business driving.

It's a prius, so no clutch. Some cars have push button start, so killing the engine isn't as straightforward (though any such OEM system I've seen you can either hold the start button in for a few seconds or hit it several times in a row to kill the ignition). Still, this is something you should know before even driving the vehicle.

Billybob
Member #3,136
January 2003
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verthex said:

could not believe that their last option to stop the car was turning it off.

I wish I had facts to back this up, but there is so much information, correct and incorrect, floating around about these topics that it's nearly impossible to find a reliable source to quote. Soooooo having said that:

Apparently you can't terminate the ignition on these cars (the ones with the stuck accelerator problems) under certain conditions ... like going 90mph. I'd be inclined to believe that this is the case, rather than assuming the 911 operator is a complete moron who didn't think to say "Have you tried turning it off?"

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Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

Billybob said:

Apparently you can't terminate the ignition on these cars...

Please, tell me this is not true! What's wrong with the drivers? And the car designers? Well, I know they can probably sell more cars when they design them to be more "fool proof" and more suitable for complete technical idiots, when the alternative would be to make cars that actually require some common sense of the drivers. And some motoric skills, spatial awareness etc.

BAF said:

It's a prius, so no clutch.

What does that mean? Automatic transmission, or just automatic clutch? Do all prius models have that? Anyway, if it's an automatic transmission, you should be able to pull it to neutral. If that's not possible, the whole fucking gear box should be forbidden! If it's just an automatic clutch, it still should be possible to pull it to neutral.

Anyway, it should be possible to turn off the ignition, which of course might cause some problems with the steering and brake power. But again, that is something that every driver should be aware of. If not, use a taxi instead.

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This thread is obviously about nothing so heres a bunny with a pancake on its head. -kazzmir

Mokkan
Member #4,355
February 2004
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I think the Prius has some crazy continuously variable transmission setup, hence no notion of a clutch or shifting. I could be wrong, though!

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Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

So it would'n even have a single stick where you choose drive/neutral? Maybe only drive/reverse? Sure you must be able to start the engine a cold winter morning, let it idle and get a bit warm, while you clean the wind shield and windows from snow and frost. Without fear from getting hit by your car when the engine suddenly decides to rush.

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This thread is obviously about nothing so heres a bunny with a pancake on its head. -kazzmir

verthex
Member #11,340
September 2009
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Without fear from getting hit by your car when the engine suddenly decides to rush.

Yeah, like what ever happened to Herbie rides again anyway?

Tobias Dammers
Member #2,604
August 2002
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The thing with Priuses is that they're hybrid-drive vehicles. They have both an electric engine and a combustion one, and the decision which one powers the vehicle at any moment is made by a computer, not by the driver. This also includes controlling the clutch, the ignition, and even the gas pedal (which is, to my knowledge, about as mechanic as the gas pedal on a game controller); the driver has no direct influence on any of these.
Consequently, shutting down the power isn't as straightforward as with a conventional vehicle.
Still, I'd imagine hitting the brakes real hard would, at some point, result in stopping the thing.

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m c
Member #5,337
December 2004
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So the prius is some sort of hybrid car? That explains it a bit then. I'm old fashioned, the most modern car I have driven is a ford fiesta.

The vehicles definitely need an emergency shut off of course.

What about ripping the fuse cartridges out of their little spot? Might take too much time with eyes off the road though... Man this has opened my eyes as to how bad those vehicles could possibly be.

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BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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The Prius has a shifter (park/reverse/neutral/drive), but no clutch. It's an automatic transmission with 3 input/outputs (engine, electric motor, wheels), so as others have said, the gear selection and balance between gas/electric is handled by a computer.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Member #5,540
February 2005
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I could have sworn I read an article on Slashdot about 12 hours ago that said Nissan or somebody was making a thing that would ensure the engine slowed down when brake and throttle were applied at the same time, and the extra stuff would only cost $50 US. I sure can't find it now though.

#define GL_TIMEOUT_IGNORED 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFull

verthex
Member #11,340
September 2009
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The funniest thing is that Toyota claims that its not an electrical problem?

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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The gas pedal getting physically stuck is not an electrical problem...

Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

the driver has no direct influence on any of these

Ok, that should hold in court.

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This thread is obviously about nothing so heres a bunny with a pancake on its head. -kazzmir

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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I could have sworn I read an article on Slashdot about 12 hours ago that said Nissan or somebody was making a thing that would ensure the engine slowed down when brake and throttle were applied at the same time, and the extra stuff would only cost $50 US.

Since the throttle pedal is electronic in modern cars anyway, a simple cutoff switch would do. For which there is a switch already in place.

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Ron Novy
Member #6,982
March 2006
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It's not the first time that's happened, but it's true that some people really don't belong on the road...

In Drivers Ed. we're taught that when you have a runaway car with a stuck accelerator to leave the car in gear, grip the wheel firmly and pump the breaks before turning off the car. Most cars will lose power steering and breaks when the car is turned off... It's too bad most people here are retarded and don't pay attention...

Anyways, I think maybe that guy could be trying to get out of a speeding ticket... What does that license plate look like to you. I read FRUGL DR !!! ::)

[edit] see the plate at 1:42, surprisingly they didn't blur it out...

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Arthur Kalliokoski
Member #5,540
February 2005
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The first thing you do with a stuck accelerator is smack the hell out of it with your foot, hoping to dislodge it. I've had mechanical linkages stick a few times, and this fixes it maybe 4 out of 5 times, but for that 1 in 5 it doesn't, brakes do slow it down, but not very fast, and the whole car is wallowing around like a rowboat in heavy seas. And it's terrifying to put it in neutral as well when it's your engine that's going to go past redline in a second or two after shifting to neutral. Of course newer cars have rev-limiters and suchlike, but still...

[EDIT]

I remember driving an ex-cop car (1987ish Chevy Impala) that did this and you couldn't turn the key far enough to kill the engine when it was in gear. All the other old Impalas did allow this, so it might have been something else getting in a bind as well.

[EDIT2]

The ex-cop car was ~10 years old then (1987) so it was 1977ish (350 cid)

#define GL_TIMEOUT_IGNORED 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFull

Johan Halmén
Member #1,550
September 2001

and you couldn't turn the key far enough to kill the engine when it was in gear

Now what exact situation is it that they try to prevent to happen by this? I can't think of anything. The only situation where gear is on and someone wants to turn the key is exactly this situation, where the throttle is stuck.

As the incident showed, it is very hard to stop the car by using the brakes, even though the power brake is in use due to the engine running. I bet it is easier to use the brakes without the additional power the running engine supplies. I have a Toyota Avensis STW (some 1.8 litre, I think) and I've used the brakes without engine. After a few pumps the vacuum power is completely used but even after that it's not that hard to stop the car. Or turn the steering wheel. And I would be terrified to drive a car, the breaks and steering of which would completely depend on the running engine. While driving old cars, it has happened to me that I've lost ignition all of a sudden.

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This thread is obviously about nothing so heres a bunny with a pancake on its head. -kazzmir

Arthur Kalliokoski
Member #5,540
February 2005
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It was obviously the result of wear on the anti-theft mechanisms vs. the tilt steering stuff.

[EDIT]

jhuuskon said:

For which there is a switch already in place.

Where?

#define GL_TIMEOUT_IGNORED 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFull

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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The one that turns the brake lights on. It's the same switch that disengages cruise control too. ::)

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Arthur Kalliokoski
Member #5,540
February 2005
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jhuuskon said:

The one that turns the brake lights on. It's the same switch that disengages cruise control too. ::)

http://www.allegro.cc/forums/thread/603335/854084#target

[EDIT]

dumbass

#define GL_TIMEOUT_IGNORED 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFull

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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What are the odds of both the throttle pedal being stuck and the brake light switch breaking at the same time?

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Arthur Kalliokoski
Member #5,540
February 2005
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About 6 people dieing vs. the number of Toyotas on the road?

#define GL_TIMEOUT_IGNORED 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFull

jhuuskon
Member #302
April 2000
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With those numbers it still qualifies as a freak accident.

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